| Author |
Topic: Four slide-in MSA pickups |
Flip Brown
From:
Vermont, USA
|
Posted 2 Dec 2021 2:18 pm |
|
Hello steeler peers - I recently acquired an MSA first-generation Millennium (#22) and it came with four interchangeable pickups. I think I have fairly good ears, however after listening through headphones with all EQ settings at neutral I'm challenged to hear much of a difference. One has "Millennium" screened on the top, another is what I believe is an "Alumtone" (all silver in color), one has a black cover with two parallel metal bars, and one is also a black cover with ten pole spots. Can any of you experienced players clue me in on how you have used these? Much appreciated!
_________________
MSA Millennium SD-10 #22, Fender Steel King with Eminence EPS-15C speaker, Lehle Mono 90 Volume Pedal, Sarno Black Box, Baby Bloomer, Sarno Earth Drive, EHX Mel 9, EHX Small Stone, Mooer Chorus, Keeley Caverns, Clinesmith bar, Acri picks, Nioma lap steel, Regal resonator, and a whole bunch of other instruments. |
|
|
|
Jim Palenscar
From:
Oceanside, Calif, USA
|
Posted 2 Dec 2021 4:58 pm
|
|
Besides the Alumitone, you most likely Geo-L 10-1, a Wallace True Tone single coil, and a
Telonics "Billy Bar"(named for my buddy Billy Easton). |
|
|
|
Darvin Willhoite
From:
Roxton, Tx. USA
|
Posted 2 Dec 2021 8:36 pm
|
|
I agree, I have 7 different pickup models for my three new style MSA's, and there is very little difference in any of them. The 705 is a little brighter than the rest but the Alumitone seems to sound the best overall, at least to my ears.
_________________
Darvin Willhoite
MSA Millennium, Legend, and Studio Pro, Reese's restored Universal Direction guitar, as well as some older MSAs, several amps, new and old, and a Kemper Powerhead that I am really liking. Recently added a Zum D10, a Mullen RP, and a restored blue Rose, named the "Blue Bird" to the herd. Also, I have acquired and restored the plexiglass D10 MSA Classic again that was built as a demo in the early '70s. I also added a '74 lacquer P/P, with wood necks.
Last edited by Darvin Willhoite on 3 Dec 2021 7:13 am; edited 1 time in total |
|
|
|
Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
|
Posted 3 Dec 2021 7:04 am
|
|
Flip, I also have several pickups for mine, and my observations were pretty much the same as yours - there is very little difference in the sound between them. It's enough to notice (under ideal situations), but probably not enough to make a significant difference in your sound, especially in a live-band setting.
Put simply, a one-number change in your mid control will likely make a bigger difference in your sound than any pickup swap you might make on a pedal steel. |
|
|
|
Flip Brown
From:
Vermont, USA
|
Posted 3 Dec 2021 2:04 pm
|
|
Thanks to everyone for your feedback. When I changed the pickups in my Telecaster and P-Bass the differences were immediately noticeable. I appreciate confirming that the situation is not the same with a steel. Besides, as is so often said in the Forum - the magic is in the fingers, not the gear!
_________________
MSA Millennium SD-10 #22, Fender Steel King with Eminence EPS-15C speaker, Lehle Mono 90 Volume Pedal, Sarno Black Box, Baby Bloomer, Sarno Earth Drive, EHX Mel 9, EHX Small Stone, Mooer Chorus, Keeley Caverns, Clinesmith bar, Acri picks, Nioma lap steel, Regal resonator, and a whole bunch of other instruments. |
|
|
|
Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
|
Posted 3 Dec 2021 2:16 pm
|
|
Flip, pedal steels are heavy, they have a lot more mass than even the heaviest solid-bodied guitars. Because of that, and probably also because of the location of the pickup, there's a lot less resonance and interaction between the instrument and the pickup in a pedal steel.
(At least, that's my theory.  ) |
|
|
|
Flip Brown
From:
Vermont, USA
|
Posted 3 Dec 2021 2:26 pm
|
|
Good point, Donny. I'm not an electronics geek (and admire those who are) but most guitar pickups measure at 6 to 9K, whereas these MSA pickups have black marks on the back in the range of 19.3 to 23.6. That's gotta have something to do with it, I assume.
_________________
MSA Millennium SD-10 #22, Fender Steel King with Eminence EPS-15C speaker, Lehle Mono 90 Volume Pedal, Sarno Black Box, Baby Bloomer, Sarno Earth Drive, EHX Mel 9, EHX Small Stone, Mooer Chorus, Keeley Caverns, Clinesmith bar, Acri picks, Nioma lap steel, Regal resonator, and a whole bunch of other instruments. |
|
|
|
Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
|
Posted 3 Dec 2021 3:03 pm
|
|
| No, not really. In my experience, low impedance pedal steel pickups exhibit the same qualities. There's still very little difference in the sound. Although they will normally sound "thinner" (more trebly), the character is more or less the same. I had a Fender 1000 pedal steel, and when the pickups were changed from 8k to 12k, the overall sound was the same, but with just a little more bass response. But you could do the same thing at the amp by turning up the bass, or turning down the treble. |
|
|
|
Johnny Cox
From:
Williamsom WVA, raised in Nashville TN, Lives in Hallettsville Texas
|
Posted 3 Dec 2021 4:12 pm
|
|
I like many thought that pickups made a huge difference in tone. When I went to work at MSA I discovered that the majority of that difference is in our heads. When changing pickups in a normal steel you listen with the old pickup then an hour later when you have taken strings off, un-soldered, un-installed, re-installed, re-wired and re-strung the guitar you have forgotten what it sounded like before and already developed an expectation in your mind of what the new one should sound like. Being able to instantly hear the difference or lack of repeatedly confirmed to me that pickups really aren't that different especially in humbuckers. What I have found though is there is a invisible wall in single coil pickups at around 15k. Pickups wound 12k to 15k are cleaner, the mids are smoother and the low end doesn't get muddy as they do in say 17.5 - 20k single coils. I really don't understand why they ever got above 15k but I know that my Sho-Bud with dual coil pickups sounds better at 9.6 k than it does at 16k. Yes the output is lower but there are booster pedals that do not change tone for that.
My 2 cents.
_________________
Johnny "Dumplin" Cox
"YANKIN' STRINGS & STOMPIN' PEDALS" since 1967. |
|
|
|
Jim Palenscar
From:
Oceanside, Calif, USA
|
Posted 3 Dec 2021 4:19 pm
|
|
| All other things being equal(which they never are) a pickup with lower ohm reading will have a thinner sound than will one w a higher reading. The reason that most guitar pickups have a 6-9k reading is that they are for 6 string guitars and the MSA in this case has 10 strings hence the higher reading. Other factors to take into consideration are type and gauss of the magnet(s)as well as the physical characteristics of the magnets used, type and gauge of wire, distance from magnet-coil, height and # turns of the coil, single coil vs. humbucker, potting vs no potting, etc. I re-wound a ShoBud 10 string pickup w 38g(vs. 42g.) wire and put the most wire I could possible get on the bobbin. It measured 5.3k and I thought it would sound awful however it sounded terrific. That pickup now resides in one of Ry Cooder's 6 string guitars. |
|
|
|
Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
|
Posted 4 Dec 2021 8:38 pm
|
|
| Jim Palenscar wrote: |
| I re-wound a ShoBud 10 string pickup w 38g(vs. 42g.) wire and put the most wire I could possible get on the bobbin. It measured 5.3k and I thought it would sound awful however it sounded terrific. That pickup now resides in one of Ry Cooder's 6 string guitars. |
Some of the earliest 6 and 7 string steel guitar pickups measured a very low D.C. resistance (under 2k ohms), and yet they still worked acceptably with the amplifiers of the day, which were very limited in power and overall gain. And I agree about the modern pickups, most of them being bigger and heavier, and having far more wire than is required to get a good sound. |
|
|
|
b0b
From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
|
Posted 4 Dec 2021 10:37 pm
|
|
I played a Sierra Session SD-12 for many years, and routinely changed pickups between songs. Some pickups work better with rock effects. Those don't do so well with traditional country, and vice versa. But there were nights when I didn't change pickups at all because everything just sounded good and I didn't want to mess with it.
_________________
-𝕓𝕆𝕓- (admin) - Robert P. Lee - Recordings - Breathe - D6th - Video |
|
|
|
