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Topic: Quilter 202 Limiter Question |
Chris Bauer
From:
Nashville, TN USA
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Posted 15 Jul 2021 6:42 pm |
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I picked up a used Tone Block 202 and am really liking the sounds I'm getting from it. However, as much as folks have talked about the interactivity of the gain, master, and limiter controls, I have yet to find a setting where I can actually hear any difference when using the limiter.
Friends have suggested using a high gain and low master setting and then slowly stepping up the limiter. I've tried every combination gain and master combination I can think of and for the life of me, i can't hear a difference in different limiter settings.
The seller now tells me that he could only hear it when using a boost or overdrive pedal. (?)
Having seen the comments of others here and elsewhere about the importance of the limiter, and having DEFINITELY been able to hear differences at various limiter settings on my Steelaire, my suspicion is that this limiter either isn't working like it should or perhaps not working at all. BUT, before either asking to return it or spending on repairs, any other things you can suggest trying that might help me know if it's working as it should? |
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Larry Dering
From:
Missouri, USA
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Posted 15 Jul 2021 7:24 pm
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| Chris, I only have a Quilter Micropro mach 2 combo and a 101 micro head. I can't tell any real difference either and like you had settings all over the place. Not sure how you would tell. |
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Jack Stoner
From:
Kansas City, MO
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Posted 16 Jul 2021 2:13 am
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I probably don't have the input gain control set correctly for the limiter. I've tried it at different settings and didn't notice any difference on my TB202.
I didn't use it when I had a Steelaire.
_________________
GFI Ultra Keyless S-10 with pad (Black of course) TB202 amp, Hilton VP, Steelers Choice sidekick seat, SIT Strings
Cakewalk by Bandlab and Studio One V4.6 pro DAWs, MOTU Ultralite MK5 recording interface unit |
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Bruce Blackburn
From:
Nashville, Tennessee
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Posted 16 Jul 2021 2:22 am
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LIMITER: The limiter acts like a “governor†on the signal peaks, monitoring the output level and reducing the gain just enough to prevent overdrive, and immediately restoring gain as the note dies away. This preserves the sustain associated with high Gain settings, while putting a soft “cushion†in front of the usual hard breakup.
Pro Tip: Limiter settings around 3-4 will limit overdrive to a “rolling boil†while settings above 5 will intervene at or below the point of breakup. The limiter is not a “brick wall†and preserves some dynamics, so its action can be subtle and can be “pushed through†with enough Gain. To hear its effect, have a friend turn the knob while you play, especially on high Gain and lower Limiter settings. Note that the Limiter does not affect soft passages, only peaks near breakup.
CLEAN CH
_________________
Rittenberry Prestige D10, Dekley S14U, (stolen) ZumSteel D10
(2) Nashville 112's Nashville 1000, Profex II Kemper Profiler Powered, Quilter Tone Block 202, Benado Steel Dream |
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Dan Beller-McKenna
From:
Durham, New Hampshire, USA
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Posted 16 Jul 2021 2:34 am
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| I had the same experience with the Quilters I owned. I wonder whether, like a compressor, one doesn't hear as much effect if the input volume is turned way down as it is most of the time with the volume pedal. Maybe try flooring the volume pedal and leaving it there while you play and fiddle with the Master-Gain-Limiter combination? |
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Dale Rottacker
From:
Walla Walla Washington, USA
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Jack Stoner
From:
Kansas City, MO
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Posted 16 Jul 2021 5:13 am
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Terminology and what a "limiter" does. It limits the max level. Anything above the preset level is reduced to the preset max level.
A compressor is a different "animal" and depending on settings will tend to bring everything up to a preset level and anything above the maximum is "compressed" to the max.
These are general definitions. There are different types of limiters and compressors with specific functions.
I see the terms mis-used many times. I've had several recording studio clients mistakenly refer to the wrong one.
_________________
GFI Ultra Keyless S-10 with pad (Black of course) TB202 amp, Hilton VP, Steelers Choice sidekick seat, SIT Strings
Cakewalk by Bandlab and Studio One V4.6 pro DAWs, MOTU Ultralite MK5 recording interface unit |
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Billy Murdoch
From:
Glasgow, Scotland, U.K.
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Posted 16 Jul 2021 5:28 am
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I had similar thoughts on the operation of the limiter but in a recent post elsewhere Travis Toy helped a lot in understanding the relation between the gain,limiter and Master. I have been unable to try out at high volume due to covid restrictions but at home levels I turned the gain full on with the master very low and then experimented with the limiter. I found a pretty good sound where the signal is just on the point of breakup which gives a nice tube type effect. I am looking forward to getting out to try it at gig levels.
Good luck
Billy |
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Roy Carroll
From:
North of a Round Rock
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Posted 16 Jul 2021 6:32 am
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I play through a Tone Block 202. The master is all the way up and the volume is controlled by the gain only. The limiter is normally set at 10 o'clock to 11 o'clock. You will be able to hear the limiter on the lower strings of the E9th neck. It will smooth the volume and sustain out without being too noticeable. Since I started using it, I have gone through many settings trying to find a good one that works in most places that we play. I turn the mids off or almost off as well. Treble at 9 o'clock.Bass anywhere from 12 o'clock to 4 o'clock depending on the room. I think the secret is to turn the master wide open and go from there.
Results may vary.
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Just north of the Weird place, south of Georgetown |
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Larry Dering
From:
Missouri, USA
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Posted 16 Jul 2021 6:59 am
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| Roy, that's interesting info. I know what Bruce and Jack Stoner said is correct. The question of being able to tell it's working is difficult to answer. For me, not enough information is put in these owners manuals to help guide the user. Be nice to know the frequency range of each tone control on all amps. |
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Douglas Schuch
From:
Valencia, Philippines
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Posted 17 Jul 2021 5:44 pm
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I don't think steelers play in a manner, generally speaking, that the limiter will have an impact. Most steelers like a clean sound, or at most just a little breakup. The limiter is to control the heavier levels of overdrive breakup, such as guitar players frequently utilize. And yes, to hear it, turn the gain way up, master volume down to reasonable levels, and limiter off and play so that you hear heavy breakup. Then gradually bring up the limiter.
It should, depending on the setting, let you get the breakup early, which a high gain will give, yet limit it from becoming extreme. This is a nice feature if you like to get a little overdrive, but don't want it to go into "heavy metal OD" mode. For example, some like a little breakup when playing a blues song.
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Bringing steel guitar to the bukid of Negros Oriental! |
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Landon Johnson
From:
Washington, USA
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Posted 23 Feb 2023 5:06 pm Chiming in
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Late to the party by a year and a half, but I have only had my 202 for a year.
I've always used the approach that for clean tones the preamp or 'gain' should be low and the master high. I use my Quilter 202 this way and am pleased with the sound I am currently getting. With those settings I do not need to limit anything.
One thing I teach my students is that, generally, 'all circuits generate noise' and 'all circuits change the signal' so it sort of rubs me wrong that my signal goes through a stage of processing that isn't necessary. I keep my limiter at zero to (hopefully) minimize any noise effects that may be there just by virtue of it being in the signal chain.
That being said, I find the Q202 quiet and extremely effective.
_________________
1989 Mullen PRP SD-10, 2021 Williams S-10, Quilter TT-12. |
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Greg Cutshaw
From:
Corry, PA, USA
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Posted 23 Feb 2023 6:57 pm
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| Just tried this on my ToneBLock 202 and Excel 12 string. Turned Master to zero, Gain to max, foot volume all the way on. Then just crack the Master until you hear a listenable volume level. I got a decent musical distortion level out of this. Cranking up the Limiter totally eliminated the distortion and introduced a compressor effect much like my Keeley compressor pedal. All of this is very pronounced only you have to make sure you are getting max output out of the steel by cranking the foot volume. Would be cool for standard guitar if it would work like this at lower gain settings but I guess that's what compressor pedals are for! |
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Jim Cooley
From:
The 'Ville, Texas, USA
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Posted 24 Feb 2023 7:46 am
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| Gain is normally thought of as increasing overdrive as the Gain level is increased. This can be true with the Quilter 202, but usually when the Master is at lower levels, and/or when the Gain is set very high. There is a definite relationship between Master, Gain, and Limiter on this amp. The Limiter has a very subtle but noticeable effect on the Gain. It does smooth the effect of higher Gain settings. I have posted here and told a few players to not fear the Gain on the 202. I often start with it set at 2:00, crank the Master, and increase the Limiter a little at a time until I get the effect I want. If the Gain is set low, the Limiter might not be needed at all. Be patient. It's there. |
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