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Topic: Harmonizing a melody |
Bob Hoffnar
From:
Austin, Tx
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Posted 8 May 2021 9:49 pm |
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Pete,
I’ll try to get to it soon. I’m in the weeds with a recording project I need to get together and the weekends are for wife duty if I’m not out of the house at a gig.
_________________
Bob |
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Scott Denniston
From:
Hahns Peak, Colorado, USA
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Posted 9 May 2021 5:57 am
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| Erv Niehaus wrote: |
To add harmony to the melody note you need to know the chord you are trying to harmonize.
And the notes that make up that chord.
And where to find those notes on your guitar by means of the pedals and levers.
All of my tabs are written in the chordal melody fashion 
Erv |
Exactly. When I hear the phrase "harmonize melody notes" I'm thinking chord melody. There is a little bit of study involved there that can keep one from spending hours (or years) spinning their wheels in a ditch. Not to over-complicate it. For example if you see a C chord over a bar and you want to harmonize a G# melody note the first chord that comes to mind would be a Caug with the #5 (G#) on top. Then (to my understanding) if the chord over the bar were a G7 for example that would suggest a G7b9 with the b9 (G#) on top. I guess piano players learn this stuff very early. |
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Erv Niehaus
From:
Litchfield, MN, USA
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Posted 9 May 2021 6:09 am
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Scott,
When I write my tabs I do quite a bit of chord substitution, especially when tabbing some of the "old standards".
They can come up with some crazy chords.
I tend to adhere to the ole KISS theory: "keep it simple stupid"!
Erv |
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Scott Denniston
From:
Hahns Peak, Colorado, USA
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Posted 9 May 2021 6:30 am
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| Thanks Erv. I think I'm starting to get it. Of course you have to start by knowing what chords you're substituting from. Things are starting to fall into place for me. I think the hard part at first will be finding a particular chord in the right inversion where the melody note is sitting on top. In Conti's course that I mentioned he's got a system for that but it's in a whole different matrix --guitar. I can probably figure out how to transfer that over. |
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Erv Niehaus
From:
Litchfield, MN, USA
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Posted 10 May 2021 6:45 am
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Scott,
Just remember that the top note is always the melody note and the harmonizing notes are below that.
Sometimes you can get all the notes you need at one position, there is no need to go up and down the fretboard. However, I like to glide up the fretboard and find the chords with the pedals and levers in order to enhance the effect you can get with the pedal steel, like no other instrument.
Erv |
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Fred Treece
From:
California, USA
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Posted 10 May 2021 7:21 am
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| Erv Niehaus wrote: |
Scott,
Just remember that the top note is always the melody note and the harmonizing notes are below that.
Erv |
That is generally true with chord melody playing, which I presume is what you and Scott are still talking about. Definitely not true with most two- and 3-part harmony though.
And you are so right about how songbook collection publishers decide what chord to insert over the staff sometimes, just because the melody note goes a little south of the basic chord structure. No wonder budding musicians look at some of those charts and say “forget it!†It took me a long time to figure out that it was usually okay to “substitute a more standard chord like G7 for a chord substitute like G7#9b5â€. |
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Erv Niehaus
From:
Litchfield, MN, USA
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Posted 10 May 2021 7:33 am
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Fred,
Yes, you are correct.
Most players only use 3 picks to play with.
Unless you want to rake the strings, that gives you access to three notes.
So, in the case of those complicated chords, I try and pick out the notes I feel are most important and determine the chord around those.
Erv |
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Scott Denniston
From:
Hahns Peak, Colorado, USA
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Posted 10 May 2021 8:25 am
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| Not to harp on Robert Conti but I really like his chord melody method on guitar. I haven't even mastered it on guitar but will begin to redo it for E9 and C6. The concepts are simple but there is some memorization involved. Here it is just in a nutshell: He uses seven different chord groups. Cmaj, Fmaj, G dom, Dm7, Am7, Dim, and Aug. . He gives you a chord for every possible note (12 notes) that could be melody notes on top in each group. As you can see, he's starting you out in the key of C then you transpose it anywhere. Now this is just the beginning. He progresses into harmonizing with substitutions. He's well known in the jazz guitar chord melody world for his personal arrangements. Even he says you can learn all his beautiful chord melody arrangements and still not have a clue about how to create them. That's the purpose of breaking it down like this he calls the "assembly line". He has a second course called "The Formula" that even goes way deeper. This is a pretty big project for a guy like me that knows more about commodes than modes but I'm jazzed! |
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Fred Treece
From:
California, USA
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Posted 10 May 2021 8:50 am
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Looks interesting, Scott. I like the idea of learning theory by osmosis rather than direct study and intention, and it looks like Mr. Conti follows that approach also. Good luck!
I went the Ted Greene route about 35 years ago. He left a monumental legacy. I’m still working my way through it on the guitar and have just recently started applying the concepts to steel. |
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Bob Hoffnar
From:
Austin, Tx
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Posted 11 May 2021 5:01 pm
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Here is a little vid I just made to show the idea of diatonic harmony. I just changed strings so be gentle about my crappy intonation.
https://youtu.be/VTu8wjihN7c
_________________
Bob |
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Scott Denniston
From:
Hahns Peak, Colorado, USA
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Posted 13 May 2021 6:52 am
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| Thanks a lot Bob. I'll get a chance to see that this weekend. We're driving straight through CO > NY today. I'm assuming it's for E9. Thanks for the video! |
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Pete Burak
From:
Portland, OR USA
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Posted 13 May 2021 9:01 am
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I liked Bob's "White Keys" analogy.
Learning things like this, forward and backwards, will open up alot of terrain on the neck... and you can also play Chop-Sticks on Pedal Steel with this harmonized scale
C Major Scale Vertical:
| Tab: |
F#|----------------------------------------8---------
D#|--------------------------------------------------
G#|-----------------------------------------------8--
E-|--------------------------8Eb----8AB----8Eb----8--
B-|--------------8----8AB----8------8AB--------------
G#|--8----8AB----8----8AB----------------------------
F#|-------8AB----------------------------------------
E-|--8-----------------------------------------------
D-|--------------------------------------------------
B-|--------------------------------------------------
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Guy Cundell
From:
More idle ramblings from South Australia
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Posted 14 May 2021 9:52 pm
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This should be useful, also.
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