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Topic: UPDATED Pics Topside and Underneath of Modified Williams |
Sonny Jenkins
From:
Texas Masonic Retirement Center,,,Arlington Tx
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Posted 13 Aug 2019 10:52 am |
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This is an older Williams that I have been modifying,,made a 700 style changer and also made and installed my pivoting (Kline) style tuning fingers. Chopped about 1 1/4" off the end,,,(if Winnie Winston can do it, it must be the thing to do,,,LOL). Just got it strung up as E9/B6. I will start rodding it up after I clean and modify the pedal bar.
Last edited by Sonny Jenkins on 9 Oct 2019 9:00 am; edited 2 times in total |
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Ian Rae
From:
Redditch, England
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Posted 13 Aug 2019 10:55 am
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Nice job, Sonny!
_________________
Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs |
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Sonny Jenkins
From:
Texas Masonic Retirement Center,,,Arlington Tx
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Posted 13 Aug 2019 10:57 am
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Here is what original tuner looked like
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Ross Shafer
From:
Petaluma, California
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Posted 14 Aug 2019 11:42 pm
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| Very nice Sonny! |
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Richard Sinkler
From:
aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
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Posted 15 Aug 2019 5:25 am
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Really nice work. That Kline style tuning head is far better looking than that long ugly one. Did you shorten the guitar?
_________________
Carter D10 8p/8k, Dekley S10 3p/4k C6 setup,Regal RD40 Dobro, NV400, NV112 . Playing for 54 years and still counting. |
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Erv Niehaus
From:
Litchfield, MN, USA
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Posted 15 Aug 2019 7:19 am
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It sure looks like it, he even notched it down.
Beautiful work! 
Erv |
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John McClung
From:
Olympia WA, USA
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Posted 15 Aug 2019 8:05 am
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That older Williams style of keyless tuner was a mess. If any of the tuning "keys" didn't line up with the rest, it would wobble and your tuning would be unstable.
Nice job, Sonny!
_________________
E9 INSTRUCTION
▪️ If you want to have an ongoing discussion, please email me, don't use the Forum messaging which I detest! steelguitarlessons@earthlink.net |
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Sonny Jenkins
From:
Texas Masonic Retirement Center,,,Arlington Tx
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Posted 15 Aug 2019 8:55 am
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Man o Man,,,what greater reward is there in life than kind, compliments from respected friends!!!! You guys sure know how to make an old man feel good,,,LOL
Richard,,,yes,,about 1 1/4". For some reason that straight pull on the old Williams tuner seems a lot harder to turn than these pivoted fingers,,,maybe I'm just used to my Klines.
Ian,,,I love your tuner,,,just haven't tried to make one work for me yet.
Ross,,,,the undisputed master craftsman!! Thanks so much,,,my stuff is definitely not CNC,,,but the best I can do with a file and a few more "tools",,,LOL |
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Erv Niehaus
From:
Litchfield, MN, USA
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Posted 15 Aug 2019 9:02 am
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Sonny,
That's the definition of a craftsman.
Erv |
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Sonny Jenkins
From:
Texas Masonic Retirement Center,,,Arlington Tx
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Posted 15 Aug 2019 10:29 am
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| Hey Erv,,,that puts me in mind of something an old craftsman told a loooong time ago,,,and I try to remind myself of it when the occasion arises,,,," a good craftsman is NOT someone who makes NO mistakes,,,a good craftsman is someone who knows how to work his way out of them",,,pretty well describes my day,,,mistake,,work my way out,,,mistake,,,work my way out,,,LOL |
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Erv Niehaus
From:
Litchfield, MN, USA
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Posted 15 Aug 2019 10:35 am
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Sonny,
My dad always said: "The man who doesn't make a mistake, is the man who doesn't do anything".
Erv |
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Ross Shafer
From:
Petaluma, California
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Posted 16 Aug 2019 8:57 am
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“Experience is merely the name men gave to their mistakes.†Oscar Wilde
"it takes wisdom to avoid mistakes...its takes mistakes to gain wisdom" I can't where I read or heard this, but it is way true!
Sonny...your stuff is top notch! I spent many, many years with files in hand (lots of filing when making bicycle frames, especially pretty ones. I look at most all machinery, including cnc stuff as really fancy files. Makin' chips is makin' chips no matter what the tool is...what counts most is the brain that doing the driving!
Oh yeah....I still use files almost every day. One of the best tools ever invented!
Last edited by Ross Shafer on 16 Aug 2019 8:59 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Sonny Jenkins
From:
Texas Masonic Retirement Center,,,Arlington Tx
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Posted 16 Aug 2019 11:45 am
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“Experience is merely the name men gave to their mistakes.†Oscar Wilde
Man I've got a lifetime of experience (and a lifetime of mistakes to prove it,,LOL!!!!
I have a little more than files,,man I'm bad with an angle grinder!!! And a rebuilt bandsaw that is so accurate I can trim my fingernails with it,,LOL,,,and a homemade cross vise on a drill press that is fairly accurate,,,and then all my old jewelry making equipment,,,after that it's blood, sweat and tears,,,LOL
Ross you're one of my heros for sure!!!
BTW,,,,I've been trying to think of the guys name, from California,,made lap steels,,,fantastic finish with tru oil. He had a bunch of beautiful exotic woods,,,He died suddenly several years ago,,,no info regarding his death,,kinda mysterious?? He set the bar for me for hand finishing for sure. You know who I'm talking about |
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Dennis Olearchik
From:
Newtown, PA
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Posted 16 Aug 2019 12:45 pm
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| Tom Pettingill |
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Sonny Jenkins
From:
Texas Masonic Retirement Center,,,Arlington Tx
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Posted 16 Aug 2019 1:52 pm
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| Yes Dennis,,that's him,,,Tom. That guy could rub a piece of wood til it shined like metal!!! I had some good conversations with him,,,miss him! |
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Sonny Jenkins
From:
Texas Masonic Retirement Center,,,Arlington Tx
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Posted 22 Aug 2019 9:42 am
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Well,,,I've started rodding this guitar,,and decided I would do a "standard" Jeff Newman E9/B6 copedent,,the reason being, aside from the fact that I've got YEARS invested in this tuning, that I'm always thinking would this work or would that be better etc,,,and since this guitar is so much easier to make changes on than my Klines,,,well, why not.
I've always wondered why pedal 6 couldn't be on a knee lever,,i.e. LKR,,,since Jeff's standard tuning does NOT include a LKR due to interference with access to pedals 5,6,7. I think Larry Bell has his pedal 6 on LKR. Well, About as far as I've gotten with rodding is RKR lowering Es, RKL raising Es,,,but I have put Pedal 6 on LKR,,and pedal 5 and 7 next to each other. Looks like it will work real good,,,save two-footing 5 and 7,,,and having LKR lower E to D when RKR is released gives a better IV7 (or 9).
Since I can use LKR for an open 7th when in E9 mode,,I'm thinking I might try putting C pedal on LKL lever,,,anyway,,,that's why I'm keeping this guitar for a while,,to allow some experimenting that I can't do conveniently with my Klines. |
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Marty Broussard
From:
Broussard, Louisiana, USA
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Posted 22 Aug 2019 4:08 pm
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Awesome Sonny
_________________
RETIRED
"Technique is really the elimination of the unnecessary..it is a constant effort to avoid any personal impediment or obstacle to achieve the smooth flow of energy and intent" Yehudi Menuhin |
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Ian Rae
From:
Redditch, England
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Posted 23 Aug 2019 1:45 am
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| Sonny Jenkins wrote: |
| I've always wondered why pedal 6 couldn't be on a knee lever |
It can. My logic when working out my uni setup was that P6 does very little - only two things in fact, one of which is already taken care of. It raises 4 (which is just the same as unlowering it) which leaves lowering 8 to D - so it doesn't merit a pedal. I have the E-D# lowers on RKR on a half-stop and I push on down to D.
Having 5&7 together is great and similar in feel to the A&B pedals.
Designing an E9/B6 copedent is all about the management of the 8th string. It must provide four notes - F(E# really),E,D# and D. In theory any of those could be the rest position, although in practice it's a choice between E and D#.
_________________
Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs |
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Sonny Jenkins
From:
Texas Masonic Retirement Center,,,Arlington Tx
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Posted 23 Aug 2019 12:57 pm
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| Ian,,great logic regarding 8th string E,,,love your idea! However,,,I have problem with half stops,,,haven't really found one that "worked" for me,,,especially that RKR, when I go into B6 I just throw that sucker over,,,not sure how I could rig a distinct half stop,,but probably could with a little thought. Thanks. |
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Ian Rae
From:
Redditch, England
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Posted 23 Aug 2019 1:14 pm
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I have to admit that it requires a little practice to get used to the ½ stop. On my Williams, because it uses a dummy changer finger, I can adjust the hardness of it.
_________________
Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs |
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David Langdon
From:
West Bridgford, Nottingham Notts, United Kingdom
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Posted 24 Aug 2019 6:24 am
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| Sonny, that's a great job you've done. Have you any underside pics to show the mounting and pivot points? I like the way you routed out the top to create more clearance for the tuner screws, it looks very neat. |
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Sonny Jenkins
From:
Texas Masonic Retirement Center,,,Arlington Tx
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Posted 11 Sep 2019 2:26 pm
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Here are pics of underneath,,,almost finished rodding,,,will probably add wrist lever. Note how easy changes are,,no clips or set screws,,,just back off the nylon nut,,,slip it out of one slot or hole and into another.
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Johnie King
From:
Tennessee, USA
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Posted 12 Sep 2019 7:20 pm
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| Super cool job Sonny great work no room for mistakes in the small confines of the narrow cabinet. It’s a lot harder to fit all the parts in a narrow cabinet. The old Sho Bud Sd 10 has enough room to turn a 18 wheeler around. Anyway grate job. |
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J R Rose
From:
Keota, Oklahoma, USA
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Posted 13 Sep 2019 8:28 am
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Sonny, Job well done. It looks fantastic. But would like to ask how or what holds the pull rods in the bell crank. It kinda looks like a swelled end on the pull rod bend? Thanks, J.R.
_________________
NOTHING..Sold it all. J.R. Rose |
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Sonny Jenkins
From:
Texas Masonic Retirement Center,,,Arlington Tx
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Posted 13 Sep 2019 9:34 am
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Yes JR,,,it is just a very small tab turned down (or up as the case may be) on the 3/32 rod, which slips very nicely in the 3/32+ slot in the bell crank,,,,best and easiest system I've seen,,,love it! One of the few things I've left original on this early Williams. I finished rodding this morning (maybe a little more tweaking?) and brought it up to my music space,,plugged it in and played a while,,,I really like it,,may do a couple more little things to it before I put it on the market. As I mentioned before, I put pedal 6 on LKR,,,looks like it may take a little getting used to, not much, but I think it will work out very well. I really like the access of pedal 5 and 7 together. Basically same set up as Larry Bell.
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