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Topic: Pedal Rack Issue |
Gary Cosden
From:
Florida, USA
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Posted 1 Jan 2019 12:36 pm |
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Happy New Years to all my forum brothers and sisters!
I want to throw this question out there to see if anyone has some insight regarding a solution to a
a problem that I'm having with the pedal rack on my Performance guitar.
The first 2 photos show the way the rack attaches to the legs – pretty standard design from what I can tell.
The 3rd photo show the proper position and the 4th photo illustrates the issue I'm having. It slips.
When I clean and lube the guitar (maybe 3 times a year) I clean the rack parts and the leg ends with contact cleaner. There is pretty much no oily substance on any piece involved here.
Yes I tighten the wing nuts as much as any sane person would. They are tight enough to hold securely by any reasonable standard. Much tighter would be abusive in my opinion.
I currently deal with the problem by applying a duct tape “gasket†to the back of the “L†pieces when I lube and clean the guitar and by then it needs it as the tape applied previously is worn through.
I have owned this guitar a few years now and it didn't have this issue at first.
I don't recall reading about this before but I have to think that it's happened to others at some point.
Any thoughts?
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Bob Cox
From:
Buckeye State
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Posted 1 Jan 2019 12:49 pm
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| Might put u a 1/2 inch spacer below it between rubber tip and rack. Also you could put a nut on it and snug it down with a open end wrench so tight it would never move. That pedal bar is probably smooth in the notched area and would hold better if you made sure the edges were sharper ,thus biting the legs better. |
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Andy DePaule
From:
Saigon, Viet Nam & Springfield, Oregon
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Posted 1 Jan 2019 12:59 pm I resolved that issue easy
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Hi Gary,
I resolved that issue easy with the 1950's Blankenship I restored.
Pedal rack slipping on the leg.
At the hardware shop you can buy 1/16" thick rubber sheet and a little double stick tape. The rubber will be in Plumbing Supply.
Cut small sections to about 1" X 1.5" and apply the double stick tape to the rubber and put that side of them to the pedal rack and the clamp and it will hold nice without making it too tight. It won't slip at all after that.
Also it's cheap to do that way.
Happy New Year,
Andy
_________________
Inlaid Star Guitar 2006 by Mark Giles. SD-10 4+5 in E9th; http://luthiersupply.com/instrument-gallery.html
2017 Mullen SD-10, G2 5&5 Polished Aluminum covering. Custom Build for me. Great Steel.
Clinesmith Joaquin Murphy style Aluminum 8 String Lap Steel Short A6th.
Magnatone Jeweltone Series Lap Steel, Circa 1950? 6 String with F#minor7th Tuning.
1956 Dewey Kendrick D-8 4&3, Restoration Project.
1973 Sho~Bud Green SD-10 4&5 PSG, Restoration Project.
Last edited by Andy DePaule on 4 Aug 2019 2:03 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Jon Light
From:
Saugerties, NY
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Posted 1 Jan 2019 1:43 pm
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| My BMI also had that tendency. It doesn't seem to have any different components from other standard steels but I wonder if there's some subtle difference in the BMI assembly. |
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Ian Worley
From:
Sacramento, CA
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Lee Baucum
From:
McAllen, Texas (Extreme South) The Final Frontier
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Posted 1 Jan 2019 2:52 pm
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Rubber garden hose washers fit the legs perfectly.
Stack them as needed, where needed. |
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Jim Palenscar
From:
Oceanside, Calif, USA
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Posted 1 Jan 2019 4:08 pm
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| Ideally the pedal rack should be trapped between the rubber can tip on the leg and the collar on the leg. |
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Johnie King
From:
Tennessee, USA
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Posted 1 Jan 2019 4:43 pm
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double post
Last edited by Johnie King on 1 Jan 2019 5:14 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Johnie King
From:
Tennessee, USA
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Posted 1 Jan 2019 4:53 pm
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Here’s the easy way spacers with set screw. Set screw is optional a plumber’s small pipe cutter will make a clean cut. Big box store has pipes that are called ceiling fan exstender’s chrome or about any color that work very well.
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Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 1 Jan 2019 7:00 pm
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| Jim Palenscar wrote: |
| Ideally the pedal rack should be trapped between the rubber can tip on the leg and the collar on the leg. |
Yes, that's the right answer. Loosen the knurled sleeve on the front legs and then slide the inner leg up so that there is no space left there, and then re-tighten the sleeve. Of course, it's possible you may have to shorten (read: readjust) the pull-rods if that front leg readjustment causes the pedals to be too low.
I try to avoid fixes that involve randomly installed spacers, wooden dowels, washers, hose clamps, duct tape, muffler bearings, blinker fluid, or tire gaskets.
But that's just me.  |
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Ian Worley
From:
Sacramento, CA
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Posted 1 Jan 2019 7:54 pm
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| Jim Palenscar wrote: |
| Ideally the pedal rack should be trapped between the rubber can tip on the leg and the collar on the leg. |
FWIW, I just checked all the guitars I have around here, an LLII, two 70s PPs, two 70s Sho-Buds and a BMI, they all have a gap between the top of the rubber tips and their respective racks, 1/4"-3/8" with the legs fully collapsed. I also have an old Fender 800, and on that guitar the chrome clamp end on the rack does fill the whole space between the collar and the rubber tip. I suppose this varies from guitar to guitar, year to year, different size tips, etc.
Worth noting that none of these guitars has had the issue with the rack sliding down, but I have observed before when a rack was loose that the leverage of the pedals pivoting off the rods actually tends to push the rack up, not down, when the pedals are depressed. |
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Lee Baucum
From:
McAllen, Texas (Extreme South) The Final Frontier
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Posted 1 Jan 2019 8:04 pm
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| What happens if you loosen the clutches and slide the legs in so the pedal rack is held firmly between the clutches and rubber tips? Does that lower the guitar too much? Or, are the legs already slid together as far as they will go? |
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Bobby D. Jones
From:
West Virginia, USA
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Posted 1 Jan 2019 8:38 pm Pedal rack issue
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First thing to check, Remove the wing nut and the metal slide. Check the slide to see if it has a bend or curve in it. If it has a curve in it, Turn it over so it will pull in tighter, Or carefully bend it back flat. Andy's suggest of rubber gripper is a good cure. Another cure would be take a piece of flexible magnet tape, Remove the protective strip place it in the back of the pedal rack slot. It is a sort of rubber for a grip, And the magnet will want to grab the steel leg.
The pedal rack must stay tight in the up position so the pedals can function without lifting the rack.
Good Luck finding a cure and Happy Steelin. |
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Al Evans
From:
Austin, Texas, USA
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Posted 2 Jan 2019 6:38 am
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A possibility nobody has mentioned:
When I first got my Mullen, the previous owner said the pedal rack had a tendency to slip on the end with A, B, and C pedals, and that you had to really tighten it up. I found the that the wingnut was hard to turn. I took that end apart, and found that the threads on the bolt were a little distorted. I put a new (hex) nut on it, using (ahem) a certain amount of force but making sure it went on dead straight, to clean up the threads. I repeated this until the wingnut screwed on and off easily and smoothly.
It's been fine since.
--Al Evans
_________________
2018 MSA Legend, 2018 ZumSteel Encore, 2015 Mullen G2, G&L S-500, G&L ASAT, G&L LB-100, Godin A4 Fretless, Kinscherff High Noon |
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Gary Cosden
From:
Florida, USA
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Posted 2 Jan 2019 7:02 am
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| To everyone who responded - thanks. And yes, I do like the height as adjusted so while shortening the leg so the rack rest directly on the rubber end would certainly do the trick I would not quite get the height that I want. I've gotten a new idea or two from the responses that I will try and report back. I'm going to try to avoid spacers if at all possible. |
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Pete Burak
From:
Portland, OR USA
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Posted 2 Jan 2019 8:52 am
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Have you considered drilling a hole directly thru the rack and leg (about a half inch to the right of the phillips head), and putting a carriage bolt thru the front, and a wing nut on the back?
[/quote] |
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Richard Sinkler
From:
aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
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Posted 2 Jan 2019 9:24 am
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| Jim Palenscar wrote: |
| Ideally the pedal rack should be trapped between the rubber can tip on the leg and the collar on the leg. |
My fairly new Mullen has a small space between the rubber tip and the bottom of the pedal bar.
_________________
Carter D10 8p/8k, Dekley S10 3p/4k C6 setup,Regal RD40 Dobro, NV400, NV112 . Playing for 54 years and still counting. |
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Dan Beller-McKenna
From:
Durham, New Hampshire, USA
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Posted 2 Jan 2019 7:16 pm
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| What Lee said: garden-hose spacers. Eazy peazy. |
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John Palumbo
From:
Lansdale, PA.
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Posted 3 Jan 2019 8:46 am
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| On a previous Carter S-10 that I owned every time you pressed down on any of the pedals you would get an annoying clacking sound. I found out that it was doing just what is posted here, the pedal rack was rising and hitting the bottom side of the knurled tighening nut on the leg. With the wing clamping nut tightened as much as possible. |
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J R Rose
From:
Keota, Oklahoma, USA
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Posted 9 Jan 2019 8:32 am
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Hello Gary, How are you doing my Friend. I am going to input what I would do if it was mine. Never put extra screws or pins into this fine instrument. You will always have a slipping problem with slick metal to metal. If you are wanting your guitar to be 1/2 inch taller Jerry Roller here on the Forum has very nice chrome 1/2 spacers that you take the rubber tips off and slide on the leg and put rubber tips back on. They look very, very nice and you can hardly tell they are on there. I have used them couple of times. Without something solid for the bar to go against it will always slip and work down. Also you might try a flat piece of rubber or cork on the side of the slide that goes against the leg but I really do not think that will hold. The pressure of your foot on the bar plus the little bit of wiggle you have in guitar will always cause it to drop down. Polished leg spacer is the answer and I know you said you did not want that. I can send you a picture of one if you like. The bottom line is the pedal bar has to set on a solid stop. Also you will have to adjust the pedal rods at the connector point. That is easy to do. Hope this helps and do contact me if I can do anything for you. And a Very Happy New Year to you and yours. J. R. Rose
_________________
NOTHING..Sold it all. J.R. Rose |
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Ron Funk
From:
Ballwin, Missouri
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Posted 9 Jan 2019 12:34 pm
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I agree with Jim Palenscar's post:
"Ideally the pedal rack should be trapped between the rubber can tip on the leg, and the collar on the leg."
FWIW, I've always marked (painted) the very bottoms of each rubber tip for each of the front legs, so that when pulling legs out of the leg bag,
I maintain consistency for legs mounted on front of steel.
Consistency can be a good thing. |
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David Nugent
From:
Gum Spring, Va.
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Posted 9 Jan 2019 2:06 pm
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| Gary..From what I have observed in the photos, the tips on your legs appear rather short. You may try acquiring longer tips from a pharmacy, the style that are featured on crutches (the units in the photo on Andy's post are a fairly good example). These may help fill the gap and possibly eliminate the need for spacers. |
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Gary Cosden
From:
Florida, USA
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Posted 14 Jan 2019 4:10 pm
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Thanks for all the great ideas people. Once again Jim Palenscar has it right by most accounts and apparently David Nugent had the same idea as I did. I bought a pair of Carex 5/8" cane tips and they gave me another 1/2" of height and eliminated the need for gaskets or spacers. So far it all seems good. Here you can see the difference in height between the original tips and the new ones.
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Drew Pierce
From:
Arkansas, USA
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Posted 14 Jan 2019 6:00 pm
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I guess I've been doing this wrong for the past 40 years. I just tighten the wing nuts sufficiently to prevent the pedal rack from slipping. Not saying I've never had the rack slip down and throw the pedals out of whack. But when that's happened I just tightened the wing nuts. Problem (?) solved.
_________________
Drew Pierce
Emmons D10 Fatback, S10 bolt-on, Zum D10, Evans RE500, Hilton volume and delay pedals. |
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J R Rose
From:
Keota, Oklahoma, USA
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Posted 14 Jan 2019 6:39 pm
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Good Choice Gary, Just what you needed and cheap. J.R.
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NOTHING..Sold it all. J.R. Rose |
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