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Topic: Stating the obvious |
Mike Neer
From:
NJ
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Posted 12 Sep 2018 8:26 am |
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For all of the brain strain that we go through, not only in analyzing, scrutinizing, departmentalizing, visualizing and [insert favorite gerund], it really all comes to down to the physical act of playing. A major part of the whole process is finding a way to play something that not only sounds articulate, but makes sense physically. Sometimes that goes completely against the logic of the layout of the notes.
It’s important to find as many ways to play something as you can, not only so you can hear the difference in articulation and timbre, as well as giving yourself options, but in making it physically easier to play. An example of defying logic is the layout of the notes in C6 tuning and how in some cases playing the notes across the strings is not always conducive to the music, especially at very fast tempos. In bebop and jazz heads especially, you’ll find that playing across the strings can be tricky, not only because of right hand picking, but because it is difficult to play cleanly and not let notes ring into each other. A balanced approach of playing across the strings and up and down the strings is required.
One specific example I can think of is Thelonious Monk’s Little Rootie Tootie. While it sounds easy enough, it can be challenging to play up tempo. I’ve recently been gigging this one and after a few months of sitting on it, I finally have it down...that is, unless I don’t. See, here is the obvious point I want to make: it’s still a physical instrument, no matter how much we think about it and plot, we still have to play it physically, which is the real challenge. Nothing but a lot of hard work is going to make it happen.
Signed,
Captain Obvious
😀
_________________
http://www.steelinstruction.com/
http://mikeneer.com |
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Andy Henriksen
From:
Michigan, USA
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Posted 12 Sep 2018 9:28 am
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It's not so obvious really. I think a lot of people (myself included) will listen to a line or lick and figure out a way to play it, and be all happy that the notes are right, but not take the extra step to figure it out another way or two to see if there's a better way to play it.
I can think of a couple examples of songs where I figure out "my part," copping some iconic melody, and played it that way for years only to eventually realize that I was playing two nearly identical parts two totally different ways for no good reason. And of course, one of those ways always seemed to give me trouble. |
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Bill McCloskey
From:
Nanuet, NY
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Posted 12 Sep 2018 9:35 am
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I can certainly relate. Playing a 10 string and now 12 string tuning gives you a lot of choices on notes and where to play them on the neck. Sometimes you want the sound a bigger gauge can make, so that might inform placement. Sometimes you want a bit more expression, so a lighter gauge with a slide might be better. It is a real challenge sometimes.
_________________
Check out the Steel Guitar Union Hall Youtube Channel https://www.youtube.com/@steelguitarunionhall |
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Scott Thomas
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Posted 12 Sep 2018 10:07 am
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| Mike, there was something you and Guy were helping someone out with and you did a clip and and it really struck me how counter intuitive it looked to get to those notes. You played them well, but it seemed hard. It sometimes has me wondering if it is worth the work to you when you can probably play them more easily on standard guitar. I have wondered if this crosses your mind, but in the end the challenge of finding a way to do it is so compelling. Your work on Steelonious is inspiring. More so when you have jazz critics who know nothing about steel guitar dig it for the music, not the "novelty". |
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Mike Neer
From:
NJ
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Posted 12 Sep 2018 10:57 am
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Scott, thanks.
Stuff that seems counterintuitive is actually is the magic of tunings like C6. It really highlights just how different it is from playing standard guitar. That is why I spent so much time deeply analyzing players like Buddy and Jerry and Joaquin, because they had insider's knowledge that I needed.
If something proves too difficult to sound good on steel guitar, I simply won't use it. In the end i am more concerned with how I sound than anything. I have a pile of songs that I've arranged for steel guitar that will never be played because they simply sound too difficult. Of course, my goal is to make the difficult sound simple, and if you hear me thinking or trying too hard than that defeats my purpose.
Improvisation on steel guitar is a whole other thing. I really wish I had taken up the instrument and the tuning much earlier--by now I would be pretty good. I do feel that I have recently turned a major corner, and that was after being stuck at an impasse for a while.
_________________
http://www.steelinstruction.com/
http://mikeneer.com |
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C. E. Jackson
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Posted 12 Sep 2018 1:06 pm
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Mike, I think I understand what you are explaining, but correct me if I'm wrong. As an older player, I have to decide whether I want to make reverse or forward slants, which determines where I play on the fret-board. Also, I have to decide where harmonics will sound best on the fret-board. Since I play only vintage steels, and all seem to have different tone properties, sometimes due to an old pickup the treble and base strings don't have the same clarity to my hearing. When playing 3 string chords with "split-string technique", Jerry Byrd's term, I try to find the best location to get the best sound for the particular song. Since I am going by my hearing, my final selections may not be satisfactory to others, but I really never know, since most listeners don't complain. I also have to determine the best locations for effective fill-ins.
As Jerry Byrd said in one of his instruction videos, just try to play the simple melody, with a few extras, and most listeners will probably enjoy your playing.
As I said in the beginning, correct me if that is not the basic message in your post.
C. E. Jackson 
_________________
My Vintage Steel Guitars
My YouTube Steel Guitar Playlists
My YouTube Steel Guitar Songs
A6 tuning for steels |
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Mike Neer
From:
NJ
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Posted 14 Sep 2018 8:02 am
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C.E., that is a big part of it. It truly boils down to the fact that we have control over every note and the way each note sounds, whether we play one note or a thousand. But unless we take the time to truly explore all the possibilities and permutations, we may be missing great opportunities to elevate our playing.
I spend a great amount of time playing and practicing my instrument, surely well beyond the "10,000 hours rule", and yet I'd be lying if I said there weren't simple little discoveries that I make on almost a daily basis that have eluded me before. Even finding new ways of playing a simple figure or chord in a song that I have played a certain way for years can inject new life into it. Mercy, Mercy, Mercy by Joe Zawinul is a perfect example for me. Or even Oleo--the list goes on and on.
It is great to have a familiarity with several tunings, specifically if you need to play a repertoire of steel-oriented classics, or even for purposes of capturing the sound of a certain genre, but if you're looking to expand your brain and create a personal style, find a tuning and stay with it until you're actually seeing the notes in your dreams (nightmares?). And hands on the guitar as much as possible!
_________________
http://www.steelinstruction.com/
http://mikeneer.com |
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Jim Fiegen
From:
California, USA
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Posted 14 Sep 2018 8:16 am knowing to notes
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Mike, I can't agree more with knowing all the notes and where they are "everywhere" in your chosen tuning. A great tip came from Larry Carlton about picking a note, C, for example and finding it everywhere on your guitar.
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http://jimfiegen.com |
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C. E. Jackson
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Posted 14 Sep 2018 3:40 pm
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| Mike Neer wrote: |
| C.E., that is a big part of it. It truly boils down to the fact that we have control over every note and the way each note sounds, whether we play one note or a thousand. But unless we take the time to truly explore all the possibilities and permutations, we may be missing great opportunities to elevate our playing. |
Mike, I agree that we should always be open to new and better ways to play old songs we know, and even new songs we have learned recently. I often am playing a song I have played for many years, and discover some little playing detail that really makes my presentation sound better (at least I think so). I, like you, am always looking for a small detail that improves my playing. They may not come often, but they do come. I think we should also always be trying to improve our bar technique, muting technique, harmonics technique, picking technique, and other techniques. Playing steel guitar seems to be a lifelong practice in improvement for me.
C. E. Jackson
_________________
My Vintage Steel Guitars
My YouTube Steel Guitar Playlists
My YouTube Steel Guitar Songs
A6 tuning for steels |
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Dom Franco
From:
Beaverton, OR, 97007
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Posted 15 Sep 2018 7:55 pm
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This is a great topic!
I too often find myself re-working a steel guitar arrangement that I have played (right or wrong) for many years.
I find it especially helpful to record a steel part and then listen to it played back with "fresh" ears. I will also attempt to "double" the steel solo on another track, and that's when I notice that sometimes I "pick" several notes in succession, and other times I will pick a note and slide to the next notes... I am inconsistent with my phrasing!
After working on a melody and or chord harmonies for a while I must decide when to slide and when to pick, when to jump to another string or up or down the fretboard.
I have noticed that I prefer whatever technique sounds the most like a vocalist. "singing" the melody on my instrument. Slower tempo tunes lend themselves to a very expressive style, with scoops and vibrato effects that can be truly soulful.
Uptempo songs require speed picking and accurate bar movement, that relies less on a "singing" style, and more on clean playing and blocking.
I have a 13 string non-pedal steel (with 4 re-entrant strings) and having re-entrant strings 1/2 step and 1 whole step apart allows for some very fast trills and chromatic runs when required.
Even slower songs can benefit from the "rocking" effect achieved between two close notes that mimic a yodel.
The steel guitar presents challenges that a standard guitar does not, but overcoming the limitations is a wonderful lifelong pastime that is well worth the effort.
Dom
_________________
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCYG9cvwCPKuXpGofziPNieA/feed?activity_view=3 |
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Paul Honeycutt
From:
Colorado, USA
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Posted 15 Sep 2018 8:33 pm
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I'm a rank beginner compared to some of you. But there are a thousand ways just to play one note. How hard you hit the string, where you pluck the string, where you have the bar, how much vibrato...
I played a gig backing an outlaw country guitarist the other night. It was a good workout. It took me until about 2/3 of the first set just to feel I had control over the picks and bar. But once I got to that point I felt like I could relax and find the music. It turned into a good night.
I'm mostly an underarm guitarist, but I love steel guitar. I'll never master it and can't imagine playing Monk or Coltrane on it. But I can make some good sounds that fit in the context of the band in a pleasing manner. If that's as good as I get, I'll be happy.
Music on any instrument is an infinite universe. |
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David M Brown
From:
California, USA
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Posted 16 Sep 2018 7:05 am Re: Stating the obvious
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| Mike Neer wrote: |
A balanced approach of playing across the strings and up and down the strings is required.
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Up and down the string is the other big issue.
We talk so much about tunings and yet so much of what makes the steel guitar special is what can be done on a single string.
| Dom Franco wrote: |
After working on a melody and or chord harmonies for a while I must decide when to slide and when to pick, when to jump to another string or up or down the fretboard.
I have noticed that I prefer whatever technique sounds the most like a vocalist.
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This brings us back to the essential Hawaiian roots of the steel guitar- it's played like you sing. The vocal quality of the steel guitar has been one of it's most important musical factors since Joseph Kekoku first put a metal bar on a string. |
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