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Topic: Carter 12 string rodding |
John Roche
From:
England
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Posted 9 Mar 2011 5:24 am |
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I need some infomation on the rodding on my carter.
What is the factory default setting for the B pedal.
What hole on the changer and what hole on the crank. |
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Bent Romnes
From:
London,Ontario, Canada
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Posted 9 Mar 2011 5:28 am
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John, there's a rodding chart on the Carter website. Try it first. Then, if you want to make changes, go by trial and error.
_________________
BenRom Pedal Steel Guitars
https://www.facebook.com/groups/212050572323614/ |
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John Roche
From:
England
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Posted 9 Mar 2011 5:33 am
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| Thanks Bent, I have looked at it but can't figure it out.. |
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Richard Sinkler
From:
aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
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Posted 9 Mar 2011 8:18 am
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The Carter info is not hard to understand if you have a copy of this diagram. I printed it out to have in my collection of info (in case this info ever disappears from the web).
Rodding locations chart
This one explains there "default" locations. Print it out too, This is for a Universal (you didn't say whether it was Ext E9 or E9/B6 Uni).
12 String Universal Rodding
Non Universal (may be same for Ext E9 12 String).
10 String Rodding
No matter which you have, they both specify for the B pedal (P2):
PB stands for pull bar (or as we sometimes call them, bell cranks). R stands for raise (finger).
String 3 - PB2 (or the second position from the cross shaft) and R1 (or the hole farthest from the axle in the raise finger).
String 6 - PB1 (or the position closest to the cross shaft) and R1 (again the farthest hole from the axle on the raise finger)
Also note that at the bottom of the 10 string chart, they list the different locations if you have a Day setup.
Hope this helps.
_________________
Carter D10 8p/8k, Dekley S10 3p/4k C6 setup,Regal RD40 Dobro, NV400, NV112 . Playing for 54 years and still counting. |
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John Roche
From:
England
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Posted 9 Mar 2011 9:11 am
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| Thanks Richard, the problem is that the G# 3 string moves before the other two G# strings making it a little mumpy, |
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Earnest Bovine
From:
Los Angeles CA USA
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Posted 9 Mar 2011 10:54 am
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| John Roche wrote: |
| Thanks Richard, the problem is that the G# 3 string moves before the other two G# strings making it a little mumpy, |
Carter site suggests "geardown" which is extra hardware on another shaft (not what the space shuttle did today 2 seconds before it landed) so all 3 strings can start and stop more or less together. Most of us don't think it is worth the trouble and we just live with it. |
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Pit Lenz
From:
Cologne, Germany
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Posted 9 Mar 2011 2:24 pm
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| John Roche wrote: |
| Thanks Richard, the problem is that the G# 3 string moves before the other two G# strings making it a little mumpy, |
That's exactly why the geardown makes a lot of sense to me:
Since the Carter bellcranks have five holes, the difference of pull distance would be too big to have all three strings on just one bellcrank.
It´s not only the effect of starting and ending the raise of all three strings simultaneusly, but most of all the (same) short slack on all three nylon tuners. So, when you press pedal B, there will be ONE homogenuous move instead of feeling the lowest string join the pull move midways, increasing the resistance in the middle of the move (almost like some half stops otherwhere).
John,
if there are any more questions, don't hesitate to post here or PM me, guess we can walk you through this. Also, if you want, I might take a picture of the geardown to clear things up a bit....
pit |
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Lee Baucum
From:
McAllen, Texas (Extreme South) The Final Frontier
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Posted 9 Mar 2011 3:49 pm
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I've never really understood what the "geardown" mechanism is our how it works. Maybe someone could post a photo or two.
I play a Mullen U-12, which has all three G#'s pulled to A's on the "B" pedal. They all start and stop at the same time with no extra hardware. |
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Pit Lenz
From:
Cologne, Germany
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Posted 9 Mar 2011 5:27 pm
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The geardown mechanism transforms a large movement into a smaller move.
If you press Pedal B, it will turn the crossshaft and bellcrank. A pullrod hooked in the outer holes (here Rod 1 in the lowest hole) will produce the largest rod travel, the closer the holes to the crossshafts, the shorter the travel of a connected rod will be.
Now a plain 3rd string will require more travel than a large wound lower one to achieve the same half step tonal rise. Therefore pullrod 1 (goes to the third string) is hooked in an outer hole.
If the difference of travel between the five holes is not enough to achieve the same rise on low and high strings, the geardown can augment that required difference.
It's like connecting a large and a small gearwheel:
A fast turning of a small wheel will make the larger wheel turn slower.
Same here:
The short throw 2nd hole of bellcrank B is connected to the longer throw 4th hole of the GD bellcrank (with rod 2) Now the same pedal movement is turned into an even shorter move on the GD bellcrank. Rod 3, that moves a lower wound string, is connected to the hole with the shortest throw in that system.
Hope that explains a bit...
pit
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Larry Bressington
From:
Nebraska
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Posted 9 Mar 2011 5:31 pm
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| John Roche wrote: |
| Thanks Richard, the problem is that the G# 3 string moves before the other two G# strings making it a little mumpy, |
John, try top hole on changer and a lower hole on puller, preferably both 6 and 3 pulling together, but 3rd string needs more pull lenght if i remember. Exsperiment with ez! 
_________________
A.K.A Chappy. |
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Lee Baucum
From:
McAllen, Texas (Extreme South) The Final Frontier
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Posted 9 Mar 2011 7:31 pm
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Thanks, Pit! I've been reading about the geardown mechanism for years, but have never seen one. That's a great drawing.
Through trial and error, I've been able to achieve the same end, without the extra hardware. By the way, the Mullen bellcranks have only 5 holes, not 6!
Lee |
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John Roche
From:
England
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Posted 11 Mar 2011 3:05 am
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| Thanks for all your advise on this matter. I'll have a look when I'm recovered from my spine operation. |
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Brian Henry
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Posted 11 Aug 2018 4:58 am
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This is an original carter gear down picture |
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