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Author Topic:  Vibrosonic Reverb
Erv Niehaus


From:
Litchfield, MN, USA
Post Posted 31 May 2018 11:04 am     Reply with quote

The JBL D130F speaker was built for Fender.
There are a couple of differences between the D130 and the D130F:
l. "Goop" was added to the D130F Surround
2. The gap was widened by shaving the pole pieces slightly.
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Mike Vallandigham


From:
Martinez, CA
Post Posted 31 May 2018 11:13 am     Reply with quote

There you have it. Thanks Erv.
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Erv Niehaus


From:
Litchfield, MN, USA
Post Posted 31 May 2018 11:16 am     Reply with quote

Mike,
Glad to help. Very Happy
Erv
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Ken Metcalf


From:
Converse Texas USA
Post Posted 31 May 2018 11:47 am     Reply with quote

I had a Vibrosonic with the Cerwin Vega / Gauss speaker.
Had some probs and had to recone.
Still had probs and had to replace.
Finally traded it for a non-master and liked that much better.
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Ken Pippus


From:
Lake Oswego, OR
Post Posted 31 May 2018 12:22 pm     Reply with quote

I loved my brown one which looked just like Mike's. One of the ones that "got away."
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Bobby Nelson


From:
North Carolina, USA
Post Posted 31 May 2018 2:31 pm     Reply with quote

I think my buddy's is a '60. He says it's 45 watts but loud as hell.

I just can't make this one happen right now. When I get more solvent, after I get my MSA paid for, I'll probably be looking for a Black face Twin I suppose - but I do love the idea of having the mate to my '73 Twin.
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Jim Sliff


From:
Lawndale California, USA
Post Posted 31 May 2018 7:49 pm     Reply with quote

For those not aware -

The Vibrasonic

and Vibrosonic

***look at the spelling**!!!!

Are completely different amps. The both have 15" speakers and are made by Fender - but that's it!

Is basically a 45 watt, 2x6L6 amp. A Concert with bigger transformers and different speaker complement.

The other is a 100 watt 4x6L6 amp. A Twin Reverb with a 15.

They are NOT the same amp.
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Bobby Nelson


From:
North Carolina, USA
Post Posted 1 Jun 2018 2:55 pm     Reply with quote

Yeah, I think the "Vibro" is the hundred watter.
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Steve Spitz


From:
New Orleans, LA, USA
Post Posted 1 Jun 2018 5:41 pm     Reply with quote

Brown Vibrasonic 1959-1963 no reverb w 15” speaker

VibrOsonic reverb mid 70s

‘Coustom” VibrAsonic reverb 95-96. Blackface cosmetics, printed circuit board,made in the US.

Check out “the fender amp field guide” lots of detailed cool info.
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George Kimery


From:
Limestone, TN, USA
Post Posted 2 Jun 2018 4:50 am     Vibrosonic reverb Reply with quote

I have not heard any opinions from my earlier post asking since the Vibrosonic was a Twin with a 15" speaker, why did the Twin with two 12" speakers become the gold standard, then fast forward, and now one 15" is the standard. (for the stuff I play, I still prefer a 12")
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Jim Palenscar


From:
Oceanside, Calif, USA
Post Posted 2 Jun 2018 5:17 am     Reply with quote

I had a brown '63 Vibrasonic w matching reverb unit for my 1st steel amp- like Mike's- had to put casters and wheels on it as it was heavy - and that was when I was in my early 20's! It really sounded good.
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Pete Burak


From:
Portland, OR USA
Post Posted 2 Jun 2018 7:34 am     Re: Vibrosonic reverb Reply with quote

George Kimery wrote:
I have not heard any opinions from my earlier post asking since the Vibrosonic was a Twin with a 15" speaker, why did the Twin with two 12" speakers become the gold standard, then fast forward, and now one 15" is the standard. (for the stuff I play, I still prefer a 12")


I own and gig with both of these amps, and the short answer is, the stock 2-12's Rola's (Blue Fender label) are way louder than the 1-15 Orange frame JBL D130.
Volume was important before folks started Mic'ing their amps.
With that said I often grab the Dual Showman Reverb Head I have here and go with a 1x12 or 1x15 cab. Usually the 1x12 because it's lighter and has a K120 8ohm speaker that I like.
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Jim Sliff


From:
Lawndale California, USA
Post Posted 2 Jun 2018 8:54 pm     Reply with quote

Quote:
I own and gig with both of these amps, and the short answer is, the stock 2-12's Rola's (Blue Fender label) are way louder than the 1-15 Orange frame JBL D130.


You're comparing a 45 watt Vibrasonic and 80 watt Twin. The speaker difference is significant but really irrelevant when comparing apples and oranges as far as the basic amps go.

The later 100 watt Vibr *O* sonic is the one comparable in output to a Twin. There the difference is primarily in speaker square inches and sensitivity, assuming both are properly serviced and relatively equal as far as tubes, bias setting, voltages etc.
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Carl Mesrobian


From:
Salem, Massachusetts, USA
Post Posted 3 Jun 2018 7:16 am     Reply with quote

Jim Sliff wrote:
Quote:
I own and gig with both of these amps, and the short answer is, the stock 2-12's Rola's (Blue Fender label) are way louder than the 1-15 Orange frame JBL D130.


You're comparing a 45 watt Vibrasonic and 80 watt Twin. The speaker difference is significant but really irrelevant when comparing apples and oranges as far as the basic amps go.

The later 100 watt Vibr *O* sonic is the one comparable in output to a Twin. There the difference is primarily in speaker square inches and sensitivity, assuming both are properly serviced and relatively equal as far as tubes, bias setting, voltages etc.


More like fruit salad once you compare schematics. Maybe I'll build a clone - I love 5881's Smile
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"The better it gets, the fewer of us know it." Ray Brown
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Pete Burak


From:
Portland, OR USA
Post Posted 3 Jun 2018 2:18 pm     Reply with quote

Jim Sliff wrote:
Quote:
I own and gig with both of these amps, and the short answer is, the stock 2-12's Rola's (Blue Fender label) are way louder than the 1-15 Orange frame JBL D130.


You're comparing a 45 watt Vibrasonic and 80 watt Twin. The speaker difference is significant but really irrelevant when comparing apples and oranges as far as the basic amps go.

The later 100 watt Vibr *O* sonic is the one comparable in output to a Twin. There the difference is primarily in speaker square inches and sensitivity, assuming both are properly serviced and relatively equal as far as tubes, bias setting, voltages etc.


Jim Sliff has made a mistake in reading the posts I guess.
The amps I am comparing are equal power. Early 70's Vibrosonic and Twin Reverb.

Note in the Quote below, the Amp Names in the post I was responding to. No mention of Vibrasonic.
George Kimery wrote:
I have not heard any opinions from my earlier post asking since the Vibrosonic was a Twin with a 15" speaker, why did the Twin with two 12" speakers become the gold standard, then fast forward, and now one 15" is the standard. (for the stuff I play, I still prefer a 12")
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Jim Sliff


From:
Lawndale California, USA
Post Posted 6 Jun 2018 3:02 pm     Reply with quote

Quote:
Jim Sliff has made a mistake in reading the posts I guess.
The amps I am comparing are equal power. Early 70's Vibrosonic and Twin Reverb.


I based it on the "V" being loaded with an orange frame D130, which only handles 60 watts when new. The assumption being you had the correct speaker for the amp.

If you're running that D130 in a Vibrosonic my advice is - don't turn it up. I've sent countless JBL's out for recones that were used by players that assumed they handled 100 watts.
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Pete Burak


From:
Portland, OR USA
Post Posted 7 Jun 2018 6:58 am     Reply with quote

They are both labeled 100 WATTS RMS (apples to apples).
The Vibrosonic is labeled TOTAL LOAD 8 OHMS (1x15 8ohm speaker).
The Twin is labeled TOTAL LOAD 4 OHMS (2x12 8ohm speakers).

The Twin with two 12's is way louder, based on my own gigging experience. It is really more noticeable with electric guitar though. They can both get into a very usable volume-pedal range for Steel on a country band bandstand.

My observation of the course of Steel-Amp Speaker size history is that 15's got popular in the early to mid 70's when Peavey became a major Steel Amp producer. 15's were in for a long time.
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Ken Pippus


From:
Lake Oswego, OR
Post Posted 7 Jun 2018 8:36 am     Reply with quote

That was the standard issue speaker in that 100 watt amp. Kind of like the original Session 400: sounded great, easy to blow.

Interesting. My orange one and the amp are both labeled 4 ohm.
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Michael Brebes


From:
Northridge CA
Post Posted 8 Jun 2018 6:03 am     Reply with quote

Per the schematics, the Vibrosonic is identical to a Twin from the same era except for the output transformer which is designed for 8 ohms, while the Twin is set for 4 ohms. Fender liked to only use 8 ohm speakers, so they changed the output transformers depending on how many 8 ohm speakers were being used in the amp. (I used to work in Fender's R & D department back in the early 80's). When I was rebuilding the Vibrosonic that I have in the shop, that's why I opted to install a multi tapped output transformer in the amp, besides turning it into a head with a separate speaker cabinet.
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Michael Brebes
MSA D10 Classic/Rickenbacher B6/
Dickerson MOTS/Dobro D32 Hawaiian/
Goldtone Paul Beard Reso

Mesa Boogie Studio Pre/Hafler 3000
RP1/MPX100
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Pete Burak


From:
Portland, OR USA
Post Posted 8 Jun 2018 6:11 am     Reply with quote

Sometimes I put the Dual Showman Reverb Head on top of the Vibrosonic, and run 'em in Stereo (from an RV3) to two separate speaker cabs.
...The guitar player looks at my rig..., looks at his Princeton Reverb..., looks at me... Alien
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Jim Sliff


From:
Lawndale California, USA
Post Posted 12 Jun 2018 6:08 pm     Reply with quote

Quote:
hey are both labeled 100 WATTS RMS (apples to apples).


Please post pictures. I'd love to see them.

I beg to differ, Unless you have a VERY unusual JBL. They were never labeled with the upper power limitation, and in literature did not use "RMS". The RMS max was 60 watts and literature listed 25 watts as "input power".

The listed 100 watts "music power" in some literature, which is what confused users...and still does. The speaker's designer spent decades on hifi forums trying to straighten out the misinformation.

Players aware of the power limits of D130F's don't use them i n 100-watt, 1x15 amps for obvious reasons.
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Ken Pippus


From:
Lake Oswego, OR
Post Posted 12 Jun 2018 10:17 pm     Reply with quote

He’s talking about the amps, Jim.
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Pete Burak


From:
Portland, OR USA
Post Posted 13 Jun 2018 7:01 am     Reply with quote

Ken, We should get a pic of our Vibrosonics together. It is very interesting that yours is a 4ohm model and mine is an 8ohm model, but both have Orange frame JBL's.
Jim, I know you are a wealth of knowledge on this stuff. Thanks for chiming in. Sorry about any Forum misunderstandings, I'm certain we would get along great in person.
fwiw, I haven't blown the speaker yet, and because I broke one tube by miss-handling, I only run the two outer tubes in it right now, so probably not enough output power to blow the speaker at the more casual volumes I play at these days.
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Jim Sliff


From:
Lawndale California, USA
Post Posted 13 Jun 2018 1:43 pm     Reply with quote

Quote:
He’s talking about the amps, Jim.


It was bit hard to determine that since it followed my speaker-specific post - as did your speaker post.

Quote:
Sorry about any Forum misunderstandings, I'm certain we would get along great in person.


No worries! Easy to tangle up 4 versions each of two...no, 3...amps and 5...no, 8,...errr, 9 speakers...or is it 4, if you discount the impedance except when the wrong one(s) is/are installed.

(multiply by the DC resistance, carry the 2...)

7.9635.

Whatever the question was, that's the answer! Oh, crap - it's Wednesday....divide by zero......But - the baffleboard!!

Mr. Green
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Erv Niehaus


From:
Litchfield, MN, USA
Post Posted 13 Jun 2018 1:47 pm     Reply with quote

Don't confuse me with the facts, my minds made up. Whoa!
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