Vertical lever question

Fred Treece · From: California, USA

I canâ€™t do a vertical lever on my guitar, but I can see why a B>Bb change became popular. There has been some discussion in another thread regarding putting the change on a pedal instead of a lever. Wouldnâ€™t matter to me at this point. My next guitar will have the change.

Anyway, I posted this question on that thread and got no response, so here goes.

Does a vertical lever work with the other levers on the same side? For example, is it possible (mechanically and physically) to get a Bmaj7 with 10-8LKR-7-5LKV?

Tony Prior · From: Charlotte NC

I removed the B to Bb on both my Steels, I prefer raise 7 on the K lever and I placed lower 6 on the vertical.

I'm sure many will comment on how many "changes" or chords I can no longer acquire.
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Ian Rae · From: Redditch, England

Allan Haley · From: British Columbia, Canada

I'm more than fully engaged learning "standard" ABC pedals and 4 knee levers. I doubt I'll ever feel a need to add more pedals or knee levers. The discussion about the myriad different changes is interesting to me as a beginner. I'm amazed how the seasoned played can pull these changes into their "on the fly" playing.

Fred Treece · From: California, USA

Brint Hannay · From: Maryland, USA

With careful placement and adjustment of the levers, it is possible to press the vertical and a sideways-moving lever at the same time. At best, it's not the easiest move to make, but if everything's set right it's not too bad.

If it's the LKR you want to combine the vertical with, I would suggest it's best to have the vertical lever be one with reversing mechanism (functioning like a rightward-moving lever). This brings the lever closer to your knee toward the right and gives better leverage.

Paul Sutherland · From: Placerville, California

Try going up three frets from your no pedal position as you add the knee raising strings 4 & 8 a half tone, and then slid your knee off that lever as you engage the vertical lowering the 5th a half tone. Then slid up two more frets as you dis-engage the vertical lever. It's a bit of an unusual passing chord combo from the one chord to the four chord.
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Dave Mudgett · From: Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee

I assume your general question is - Can you activate both LKV and LKR (or LKL) together?

I have been able to set most of my steels up so LKV can work with the other left levers, but it sometimes take some work to set it up right and does tend to be more awkward. The pivots on mine are all on the right, unlike Brint's preferred configuration, but I can generally make it work. For me, it's a function of both the levers being close to each other plus my leg's geometry relative to the cluster. Ergonomics is critical.

And that is yet another reason I have 4/8 E=>Eb lowers on RKL, because there's so much one can do with 5 B=>Bb (and 6 G#=>F#) against E=>Eb, especially when it's on the other knee. Just yesterday I made that switch on the G2 which I got a couple of years ago and left E=>Eb on LKR just to try it again. I was even starting to get used to it again after just a few days playing it, but to me, it just drove home once again how much I prefer E=>Eb on RKL.

I didn't respond to that thread because I don't see any point in getting into a "this doesn't belong there" thing, when in many cases, "this can work just fine". But as usual, every decision about pedal/lever changes ultimately trades off one thing for another.

PS - obviously you only get Bmaj7 that way if you just lower 5 B=>Bb. Again, tradeoffs. I have mine set to lower both. But if I just want 5, it's easy enough to back off the string 10 tuning nut (on an all-pull, at least) for a tune or two, and then re-tune it. Takes 10-20 seconds.

Mike Perlowin · From: Los Angeles CA

Brint Hannay · From: Maryland, USA

My apologies for inartful language in my dashed-off sketch. I'm not saying there's anything wrong with any particular pivot point! I should have said "as opposed to this" instead of "not" this. Oh Well

On my Mullen I can press the vertical with any of the other four left knee levers.

As the OP referred specifically to combining LKV with LKR, I thought I'd pass along something I feel I've learned from my experience. On one of my other guitars, I found that the left-knee combination with the vertical that I most wanted turned out to require jamming my knee way up into the angle formed by the two pivot points, and was pretty uncomfortable for me.

Tim Russell · From: Pennsylvania, USA

Skip Edwards · From: LA,CA

The B to Bb lever works well with a lever that raises string 1 a whole tone and string 2 a half.
The only thing is those 2 levers should be on a different leg from each other.

Tony Prior · From: Charlotte NC

Charley Bond · From: Inola, OK, USA

Here is one I designed... it could be used going left or right, depending on the setup. It is lightning fast & easy to use. I raise my Es to F#.

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Fred Treece · From: California, USA

Thanks to everyone for the informative responses. Brint Hannay, your drawing was very helpful. Charley Bond, that is a pretty cool design.

Richard Sinkler · From: aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana

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