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Topic: Rick Academy (bakelite) low string problem |
Stuart McKenzie
From:
Hawaii, USA
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Posted 6 May 2016 11:21 am |
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Hello,
I'm new to the forum and have a 1948 Rick Academy (bakelite). There is a problem with a low string. When I place the steel on the strings, it doesn't touch the .036 string. Looks like the cut at the tuner end is too deep. Any suggestions for a fix?
Mahalo, Stuart
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Tom Pettingill
From:
California, USA (deceased)
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Rick Aiello
From:
Berryville, VA USA
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Posted 6 May 2016 2:07 pm
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Yep ... Devon Steel Epoxy is what you want ...
Tape off the sides ... Fill with the Devcon ...
Let it cure 7 days ... Regardless of what they say ...
Sand down with 220 grit till it's all flush ...
Buy a gauged nut file from Stew-Mac for the gauge you want ...
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Stuart McKenzie
From:
Hawaii, USA
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Posted 6 May 2016 5:53 pm
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Thanks Tom & Rick,
Appreciate the suggested fix. Letting it sit still for a week will be hard but I understand its not something to do over again.
Mahalos |
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Nathan Laudenbach
From:
Montana
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Posted 6 May 2016 7:02 pm
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| You do not need to buy a special file from Stew Mac. A small triangular file will work just fine. I am not a luthier but I do guitar setups at work every single day and the small triangular file I bought at a used tool store works great. I was advised by our in house luthier of nearly thirty years. |
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Keith Glendinning
From:
United Kingdom
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Posted 7 May 2016 12:54 pm
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| Nut files are expensive and if dropped they can break. I bought a set of Welders Tip Files from eBay as an alternative. They include a good range of sizes to match the string gauge that you intend to fit. Plus they're very cheap! |
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Rick Barnhart
From:
Arizona, USA
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Posted 7 May 2016 2:34 pm
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Since you only want to do this once, the gauged file will help get the proper width and depth for the string gauge. .036 gauge nut file from Stew-Mac, $27. The correct advice from Tom Pettingill & Rick Aiello, priceless.
_________________
Clinesmith consoles D-8/6 5 pedal, D-8 3 pedal & A25 Frypan, Pettingill Teardrop, & P8 Deluxe. |
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Harry McIlwain
From:
Mississippi, USA
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Posted 7 May 2016 6:06 pm
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Looks as though the nut has a radius on the bass side judging the way the bar is resting on it??
Harry |
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Charlie McDonald
From:
out of the blue
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Posted 8 May 2016 4:06 am
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| Keith Glendinning wrote: |
| Nut files are expensive and if dropped they can break. I bought a set of Welders Tip Files from eBay as an alternative. They include a good range of sizes to match the string gauge that you intend to fit. Plus they're very cheap! |
Thanks for the tip (  ), Keith. Fits the bill and budget. |
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George Piburn
From:
The Land of Enchantment New Mexico
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Posted 8 May 2016 5:47 am Welders Tip Cleaners to String Gauge conversions
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I do agree with Tom and Rick about using Guitar Shop Files.
I looked up drill size conversions for those who choose to use the tip cleaners.
Hopefully this chart will help in future inquiries.
Inches Designation = String Gauge
.0135" #80
.0145" #79
.016" #78
.018" #77
.020" #76
.021" #75
.0225" #74
.024" #73
.025" #72
.026" #71
.028" #70
.0292" #69
.031" #68
.032" #67
.033" #66
.035" #65
.036" #64
.037" #63
.038" #62
.039" #61
.040" #60
.041" #59
.042" #58
.043" #57
.0465" #56
_________________
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Maker of One of a Kind Works of Art that play music too.
Instructional DVDs
YouTube Channel |
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Stuart McKenzie
From:
Hawaii, USA
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Posted 8 May 2016 6:47 am
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Thanks for the reply's. I have the nut file coming and if can I will post photos. If no can, no can. 
Brudda |
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Tom Pettingill
From:
California, USA (deceased)
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Posted 8 May 2016 9:20 am
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Thats great Stuart, you will have that steel singing and playing great soon.
Low strings in the nut are no fun and one of my pet peeves. To compensate, you end up mashing down the bar which not only is uncomfortable, but throws the tuning balance amongst all the strings as a whole out of whack.
Like many things in life, there are many ways to get there. Triangle files and tip cleaners can get the job done, but there are compromises. Idealy, you want a string slot just a little larger than the string diameter with a round bottom. A triangle file makes a V shaped slot and while tip cleaners are round, they are not made for serious material removal and the small sizes are pretty flimsy. In a pinch, you could certainly use a triangle file to get you most of the way there and followed up with a tip cleaner to round out the bottom. A tedious adventure no doubt.
Another DIY method is to make some little saws / files out of feeler gauges. Take a file and round off the edges, then cut / file some teeth on the edge. Don't expect to be removing a lot of material with them, but they can work a little better than the flexing tip cleaners.
Its hard to justify spending $100 or more for a set of files that you only plan to use once. Years back when I made my very first steel, I explored all kinds of different options. It it did not take me long to pony up and get a proper set. In the end, there is nothing like having the proper tool for the job.
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_________________
Some misc pics of my hand crafted steels
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Rick Aiello
From:
Berryville, VA USA
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Posted 8 May 2016 5:43 pm
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I can't tell y'all how many Bakelite bridges and nuts I've fixed ... After folks took files to them ... To try and "level off" strings with varying gauges ...
Talk about a "Pet Peeve" .. 
Some were so butchered ... I had to rebuild the entire bridge ... And nuts ...
The Devcon is much harder than Bakelite ... 85D on the Shore hardness scale ....
I suggest that if the bridges don't need to be slotted ... Don't !!!!
Some have to be done because of poorly drilled string thru holes ... Many don't align the strings directly over the poles ... And need a positioning slot ...
Most of the nuts were slotted for a major tuning ... So the big strings slots are way deep to deal for a C6 or C6/7 tuning ...
As stated, the Devcon is harder than Bakelite ... So a real U shaped luthier file is really your best choice ...
Why buy a highly admired vintage steel ... Take the time to rebuild the "flaws" brought on by years of abuse ... And not want to spend another $13 to $78 for a set of luthier files .. To do the job right ....
Just trying to help ...
Last edited by Rick Aiello on 9 May 2016 4:50 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Keith Glendinning
From:
United Kingdom
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Posted 8 May 2016 11:17 pm
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Rick,
I agree fully with your comment that the nut "slot" has to be U shaped. As a retired Engineer I have to offer the following comment.
A nut file In the hands of an amateur can result in an botched slot in the nut rather than the desired vertical slot. Aditionally, as I said in an earlier post, nut files are an expensive, brittle item which is a "one size" only, whereas Welders Tip Files are cheap, readily available on eBay and if you have a micrometer or caliper gauge you'll find one to match almost EVERY string gauge. I have used them with Aluminium, Brass, Stainless Steel and also Buffalo Bone nuts.
If you are a professional builder, go with a full set of Nut Flies, but a "one off" job amateur can't justify the expense of these files. Just an observation from an enthusiastic amateur.
As an aside. When I was a Marine Engineer in the 1960's, we used Devcon for all kinds of repairs in the the Engine Room. It always gave the best results for all kinds of unusual conditions.
Keith. |
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Stuart McKenzie
From:
Hawaii, USA
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Posted 11 May 2016 7:44 am
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This has turned out to be a good thread... may be helpful to someone else in my shoes.
BTW, from Stewart McDonald the files are 13.73 each, in my world that is affordable. Also, since I am a novice and I am only doing one slot, having the correct file is one less thing that can go wrong.
Mahalo |
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Wally Pfeifer
From:
Illinois, USA
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Posted 11 May 2016 9:12 am
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Hi Stuart,
I would suggest you take Tom & Rick's advice and ignore the rest. Do it right !
Wally  |
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Stuart McKenzie
From:
Hawaii, USA
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Posted 14 May 2016 2:44 pm Not perfect but...
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OK, so here are some photos of the job. Please note, I am happy with the results because it is better than it was. Also, it occurs to me now that we cannot expect it to be perfect because different string gauges will change what is presented.
Mahalo for every post. A hui hou
Bruddah
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Stuart McKenzie
From:
Hawaii, USA
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Posted 14 May 2016 2:48 pm Couple more Photos
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continued...
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Stuart McKenzie
From:
Hawaii, USA
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Posted 16 May 2016 5:40 pm Ps
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I broke two strings putting it all back together so decided to replace them all. Here is something I probably should have done 1st. that is check to see if the correct guage strings are on for c6 tuning. Turns out the CEG strings were not even in the ball park. 
I don't feel that bad, chock it up to newb. Any way just passing it on for others to avoid the problem. Turns out the repair I made came out purrrfect. Couldn't have done that if I tried.
And... I like the tone. Now if I can just stick with it and learn how to bar and pick and mute. It is fun.
Brudda
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Tom Pettingill
From:
California, USA (deceased)
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