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Topic: Amateur C6th Copedent Question |
Dale Rottacker
From:
Walla Walla Washington, USA
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Posted 9 May 2023 4:55 am |
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Recently I've been fooling with the "Reverse" 6th pedal on C6th, where I'm now raising the 6th string E>F and lowering the 2nd String E>Eb.
I had contemplated putting this change on the 4th pedal, and actually did it on my Rittenberry, but on my MSA thats a tad more involved.
After much head scratching at what could I give up to have this change, I put it on my RKR where I was raising the C's. There are some things I really like about raising that 6th string, but find that I'm missing raising that top C string more than I thought I would.
So the question is this: How badly do I screw things up by losing the 2nd lower and change it back to raising the 3rd string to C and leaving the the 6th string raise to F. Are there any Pro's or Con's to this move? I'm guessing some conflict, but not theory knowledgeable enough to know what all that would be.
Thanks for the help.
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Dale Rottacker, Steelinatune™
*2021 MSA Legend, "Jolly Rancher" D10 10x9
*2021 Rittenberry, "The Concord" D10 9x9
*1977 Blue Sho-Bud Pro 3 Custom 8x6
https://msapedalsteels.com
http://rittenberrysteelguitars.com
https://www.telonics.com/index.php
https://www.p2pamps.com
https://www.quilterlabs.com |
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Roger Rettig
From:
Naples, FL
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Posted 9 May 2023 6:12 am
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I too have been tempted to raise both Es to F, Dale.
I discussed this with Sez Adamson who thought that doing so was a way for primarily E9 players to feel more at home. He may have had a point.
I've tried it and liked it but it may have been just because I liked getting the full F major without the b7. I don't have it now.
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Roger Rettig - Emmons D10s, Quilter TT-12, B-bender Teles and old Martins.
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K Maul
From:
Hadley, NY/Hobe Sound, FL
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Posted 9 May 2023 6:18 am
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My C6 playing is not very complex. I actual use B6 and my pedal 4 raises both 2&6 Eb strings to E. Then I move the bar around a lot!
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Kevin Maul: Airline, Beard, Clinesmith, Decophonic, Evans, Excel, Fender, Fluger, Gibson, Hilton, Ibanez, Justice, K+K, Live Strings, MOYO, National, Oahu, Peterson, Quilter, Rickenbacher, Sho~Bud, Supro, TC, Ultimate, VHT, Williams, X-otic, Yamaha, ZKing. |
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J D Sauser
From:
Wellington, Florida
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Posted 9 May 2023 6:21 am Re: Amateur C6th Copedent Question
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| Dale Rottacker wrote: |
Recently I've been fooling with the "Reverse" 6th pedal on C6th, where I'm now raising the 6th string E>F and lowering the 2nd String E>Eb.
I had contemplated putting this change on the 4th pedal, and actually did it on my Rittenberry, but on my MSA thats a tad more involved.
After much head scratching at what could I give up to have this change, I put it on my RKR where I was raising the C's. There are some things I really like about raising that 6th string, but find that I'm missing raising that top C string more than I thought I would.
So the question is this: How badly do I screw things up by losing the 2nd lower and change it back to raising the 3rd string to C and leaving the the 6th string raise to F. Are there any Pro's or Con's to this move? I'm guessing some conflict, but not theory knowledgeable enough to know what all that would be.
Thanks for the help. |
I can probably say that I have “all” the changes on my S12 C6th with 6P & 8K.
I have the “inverted P6” change too. So do a handfull of very advance C6th players like Doug Jernigan. I am by far not at that level, but I have the hardware.
I would put it on the list of changes which can be useful but really behind many other add-ons.
I see the 6th string whole step drop and also the 5th string whole step drop more of a “wouldn’t want to be without it”-changes… which PF also has, but that’s for MY approach!
The C-to-C# raise you mention, is a rather under-valued change which specially in conjuncture of P5 is a game-changing change, one of the reasons I have it in lieu of P4 just left of P5 allowing me to play it like E9th’s “A&B”-Pedals. It’s as touchy and difficult to tune as the E-to-F change on E9th, as it fights the JI flat tuned E string (M3rd of C)… pushing one closer to ET tuning as changes are added.
But that wasn’t your question. I guess what I am trying to say probably is, that I would not jeopardize something which works for you for that inverted P6 change.
One thing I would add, is that it is VERY important WHERE one puts a chnge. Changes shouldn’t be looked at only as stand-alone. Well positioned, a change can create a wealth of new possibilities in conjunture with othe changes which have to be accessible while holding tha change. One of the reasons I have come to put my “P6”-change on RKL intead of a pedal, which moved the “P7”-change next to P5 and gives me among other combinations the ability to play all 3 changes, known as “P5, P6 and P7” together and still lower my A and C strings. Just as an example.
… JD.
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Was it JFK who said: Ask Not What TAB Can Do For You - Rather Ask Yourself "What Would B.B. King Do?"
A Little Mental Health Warning:
Tablature KILLS SKILLS.
The uses of Tablature is addictive and has been linked to reduced musical fertility.
Those who produce Tablature did never use it.
I say it humorously, but I mean it. |
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John Swain
From:
Winchester, Va
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Posted 9 May 2023 6:39 am
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| Dale, I would take a good look at Buck Reid's setup. I'm using it with the inclusion of a whole step lower of string 6 on CKV. |
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Dale Rottacker
From:
Walla Walla Washington, USA
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Posted 9 May 2023 7:04 am
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| John Swain wrote: |
| Dale, I would take a good look at Buck Reid's setup. I'm using it with the inclusion of a whole step lower of string 6 on CKV. |
Thanks everyone for your help.
John I have looked at Bucks. The problem I have with putting it on pedal 4 is that on the MSA, I'd have to have 2 rods each with a 2 string bend in them as the belcrank hardware can NOT be moved without dismantling what's there to accomplish it, and I'm not willing to go quite that far. Another issue (which I could change) is needing to do the Texas Two-Step to use it with any pedal but the 5th. But I guess thats something I could re-learn to do. The only other place I can see to put it would be on my MKL but don't know that I'm willing to give up the Maurice change.
I went on a 2 year journey on E9th to "Have it ALL" and now that I pretty much have it, have spent 95% of my time on C6th  I know I already have more on both necks than I'll ever understand, but I always tend to reach for something more.
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Dale Rottacker, Steelinatune™
*2021 MSA Legend, "Jolly Rancher" D10 10x9
*2021 Rittenberry, "The Concord" D10 9x9
*1977 Blue Sho-Bud Pro 3 Custom 8x6
https://msapedalsteels.com
http://rittenberrysteelguitars.com
https://www.telonics.com/index.php
https://www.p2pamps.com
https://www.quilterlabs.com |
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