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Topic: Frankenstein 50's Gibson Console Grande- Where to begin? |
Tommy Martin Young
From:
Sacramento-California, USA
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Posted 1 Oct 2017 11:22 am |
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Just upgraded from my Chipas Regal 6-stringer to this well-worn and broken-in (not broken -down) beater...just my style. $545 delivered - I have just started this wonderful journey called lap steel after 25 years of harmonica and guitar and building things that make in-tune noise. With the Lap Steel I may have finally found the instrument that allows me to play what I hear in my head...is that what they mean by "finding your voice"?
I am hoping the centuries of combined experience in this forum can help me wrap my head around what the heck is going on with this "Custom" assuming it's structurally sound...should I leave it alone? (definitely switching out input jack) I have numerous Frankenstein instruments and I didn't buy this for its resale value or its good looks -I bought it because it looks like a gig-worthy Gibson Grande for $500 and if I treat her nice...perhaps it'll be a Ouija Board and I can channel "Lee".
Your thoughts are most appreciated!
Tommy
Last edited by Tommy Martin Young on 1 Oct 2017 8:11 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Jay Yuskaitis
From:
Massachusetts, USA
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Posted 1 Oct 2017 2:20 pm
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| Where to begin? At the beginning. Brings back memories. Jay Y. |
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Brad Davis
From:
Texas, USA
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Posted 1 Oct 2017 6:29 pm
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| Ouch. Some sort of pedal mod. Pretty brutal. There was a period of time in the 50s when this was acceptable though. |
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Tommy Martin Young
From:
Sacramento-California, USA
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Posted 1 Oct 2017 8:10 pm
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Any reason to think it will affect the sound or playability?
Yes...pretty beat-up. I'm a sucker for rescue dogs and homeless guitars.
| Brad Davis wrote: |
| Ouch. Some sort of pedal mod. Pretty brutal. There was a period of time in the 50s when this was acceptable though. |
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Brad Davis
From:
Texas, USA
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Posted 2 Oct 2017 5:50 am
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Well, post-war GCG's are such massive pieces of wood that they can probably handle a lot of this abuse. Those pickups sound wonderful BTW. The worst route seems to be across your front neck which is much thicker.
Biggest concern would be the compromise to the bridges and bridge area -- I can't really see what is going on there but looks like they are ruined and very well might affect tone or sustain these guitars typically have. Those bridges are hard to replace, and most of the supporting wood looks like its just gone anyway. Maybe the remains of that mechanism do the job, but not necessarily as well as the original bridge and wood. I can't tell, but you may have a set of original knobs, although they maybe look a little tall.
I don't know about the feasibility of a full restoration, lot of wood would have to be replaced. The rest of the top of the guitar looks fine though.
This is pretty extreme. I've seen these mods just done on 3 or 4 strings of an outer neck. |
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Tommy Martin Young
From:
Sacramento-California, USA
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Posted 2 Oct 2017 7:04 am
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| Thanks Brad. I will post more detailed pics of the bridge and mods when I get the Grande on the bench. My thought (hope) was that there was some method to the madness..and that it was all done on a quest for tone. My job is to see if I can turn it into a daily driver. |
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Brad Davis
From:
Texas, USA
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Posted 2 Oct 2017 7:27 am
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It wasn't a quest for tone, the guitar had the tone to begin with. It was pursuing the hot new pedal fad.
Makes me want to hug my Console Grande tonight. |
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Karl Paulsen
From:
Chicago
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Posted 2 Oct 2017 7:31 am
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Lovely and horrifying at the same time!
Since vintage correct is no longer a concern, it looks like putting a nice big block of wood against the back where it was cutaway for each side is probably the start. Then putting in a pair of new bridges on top of that and you should be good to go.
Probably no need to fill the routes on the bottom. Get rid of any metal bits you can though maybe leave the back plates in place for now?
The good news is that the bridge covers will cover most of this.
Hope it goes well for you. |
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J Fletcher
From:
London,Ont,Canada
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Posted 2 Oct 2017 8:28 am
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| I agree that replacing the missing wood at the tail end is a good idea. You will need to remove all of the added changer mechanism. Can you post a pic with the bridge covers removed? |
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Tommy Martin Young
From:
Sacramento-California, USA
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Posted 2 Oct 2017 8:53 am
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So even in the pre-digital days guitarists were thinking "a pedal" might be the secret sauce! I started researching Grande parts and pedals and found this one https://reverb.com/item/2618024-gibson-console-grande-50s-d8-custom-2-pull-pedal-steel-guitar-w-ohsc
Bridge seems fairly standard and I have found a few online that will fit under the bridge cover. Also found this factoid: Gibson shipped the Grande Console with Hyblum plates that extend from the bridge, under the fret-board, and terminate at the nut.
Gibson stated that Hyblum plates are for improved tone quality and sustaining power.
When I receive the Grande I will take pics of the autopsy.
| Brad Davis wrote: |
It wasn't a quest for tone, the guitar had the tone to begin with. It was pursuing the hot new pedal fad.
Makes me want to hug my Console Grande tonight. |
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Karl Paulsen
From:
Chicago
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Posted 2 Oct 2017 9:02 am
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One other suggestion for budget repair from someone with no real lap-restoration experience but a fair bit of experience rescuing guitars and basses.
Once you get the blocks of wood in there, if you want to make it a bit prettier without undertaking a massive refinishing effort, maybe buy a sheet of pickguard material. A simple black or cream would be nice looking and not at all expensive.
Paint the new blocks of wood black so they don't draw attention to themselves, Then cut two squares of Pickguard material to completely cover the rear areas that were cut away. You can even use the holes that were already added to screw them in place. WIll look alot better and at some point in the future if you want to you can go back and have the ends paint matched or refinished. |
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C. E. Jackson
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Tommy Martin Young
From:
Sacramento-California, USA
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Posted 2 Oct 2017 4:36 pm
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Thanks Everyone for the input and tips. Before I made any mods I was actually planning on doing what C.E mentioned - play it as-is for a while. Thing is I am so new I don't know what it's "supposed" to sound like...I don't think I could coax honeytones out of the world's finest lap steel...yet!
This Gibson reminds me of 1983 when I bought my first car... a "beater" '69 convertible GTO that I bought for $800; a rust-bucket w/ every shade of primer but it had 350 HP and a brand new $400 top! Ugly as sin but love is blind - and since time makes you forget the bad stuff (like not starting)... she's still one of the most awesome cars I ever owned, because she taught me that good bones matter..and in 20 years it'll be fun to say my first "Real Steel" was a chopped & channeled '53 Gibson Grande with cig burns and a chipped fretboard.
Pics to come!
_________________
The One & Lonely Tommy Young
"Now is the time for drinking;
now the time to beat the earth with unfettered foot."
-Quintus Horatius Flaccus (65-8 B.C.) |
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Herb Steiner
From:
Spicewood TX 78669
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Posted 8 Oct 2017 12:22 pm
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I'm the type of guy that would chose to do a full restore on that instrument, including a period correct refinish. It would cost some bucks, maybe more than the instrument would be "worth," but in some circumstances the Universe demands that some wrongs be made right.
The missing wood both on the corners and underneath the console could be replaced/repaired by a good steel luthier like Mark Giles. I would want Mark to refinish the guitar in the exact colors it has now. Non-original tailpieces can be fabricated fairly easily. Leg sockets are available that fit modern steel guitar legs.
Doing so would add value back to the world by increasing the stock of vanishing breed of instrument, and improve the karma of the soul financing the project.
Just sayin'...
_________________
My rig: Infinity and Telonics.
Son, we live in a world with walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with steel guitars. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinberg? |
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Lee Jeffriess
From:
Vallejo California
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Posted 9 Oct 2017 7:50 pm
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| Isn't that my guitar ? |
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Tommy Martin Young
From:
Sacramento-California, USA
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Posted 9 Oct 2017 9:07 pm
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Lee,
I was hoping that it was yours and that you'd left the secrets to unlocking the lap steel code under the fretboard.
If you're ever back in Sac - I'll bring it by.
My band - the Chrome Addicts use to open for you guys all the time at Old Ironsides and then we & the Rockabilly girls would take Robert out on the town....for some reason I think Bobby and I have the same the b-day because I remember celebrating more than once...
Cheers!
I get the GCG on Wed and will post pics of its progress.
_________________
The One & Lonely Tommy Young
"Now is the time for drinking;
now the time to beat the earth with unfettered foot."
-Quintus Horatius Flaccus (65-8 B.C.) |
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Lee Jeffriess
From:
Vallejo California
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Posted 10 Oct 2017 6:18 am
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| Tommy, I remember you guys ! great band, they were fun days |
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Bill Sinclair
From:
Waynesboro, PA, USA
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Posted 10 Oct 2017 8:21 am
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| Tom Young wrote: |
Bridge seems fairly standard and I have found a few online that will fit under the bridge cover. |
Tom,
Would you mind sharing the links to these standard bridges? I'm having a hard time finding any eight string bridges that would work in this type of application.
Very cool guitar. Looking forward to seeing what you do with it. I think I'd keep Lee's sig on the front.  |
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Tommy Martin Young
From:
Sacramento-California, USA
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Posted 10 Oct 2017 12:13 pm
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Hi Bill,
I have had great luck with Georgeboards (their Artisan/Rogue is awesome!) so I may go with the carbon fiber+brass http://www.georgeboards.com/parts.html
Rukavina sure is pretty
The original Gibson bridge looks like this
@Herb - I will take your seasoned advice into mind as I fully understand & appreciate the balance of the universe.
_________________
The One & Lonely Tommy Young
"Now is the time for drinking;
now the time to beat the earth with unfettered foot."
-Quintus Horatius Flaccus (65-8 B.C.) |
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Andy DePaule
From:
Saigon, Viet Nam & Springfield, Oregon
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Posted 11 Oct 2017 5:54 am Perhaps it'll be a Ouija Board and I can channel "Lee"
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If you ever do get "Lee" and he admits to doing this to that steel give him what for!    
_________________
Inlaid Star Guitar 2006 by Mark Giles. SD-10 4+5 in E9th; http://luthiersupply.com/instrument-gallery.html
2017 Mullen SD-10, G2 5&5 Polished Aluminum covering. Custom Build for me. Great Steel.
Clinesmith Joaquin Murphy style Aluminum 8 String Lap Steel Short A6th.
Magnatone Jeweltone Series Lap Steel, Circa 1950? 6 String with F#minor7th Tuning.
1956 Dewey Kendrick D-8 4&3, Restoration Project.
1973 Sho~Bud Green SD-10 4&5 PSG, Restoration Project. |
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Jack Hanson
From:
San Luis Valley, USA
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Posted 11 Oct 2017 6:30 am
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| Tom & Bill, check your PMs. |
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Tommy Martin Young
From:
Sacramento-California, USA
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Posted 12 Oct 2017 8:13 am Gibson Console Pedal Hack
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As was mentioned earlier by someone- I guess this was done by a few people back in the day. I have seen it referenced in other posts. Thanks to Jack for the bridge replacement tip!
Any guesses as to vintage? Has the tall knobs, rectangle pickups...and I have seen one other GCG with a black control panel.
Pickups work, pots need cleaning...actually the whole things needs cleaning...on the Gentle Cycle of course. Will start the teardown this weekend
_________________
The One & Lonely Tommy Young
"Now is the time for drinking;
now the time to beat the earth with unfettered foot."
-Quintus Horatius Flaccus (65-8 B.C.) |
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