| Which way does the steel go in? |
| Pedal side closer! |
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5% |
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| Pedal side farther! |
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94% |
[ 70 ] |
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| Total Votes : 74 |
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Topic: [deleted] |
Jim Lill
From:
Tennessee, USA
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Posted 26 Jul 2017 8:29 pm |
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[deleted]
Last edited by Jim Lill on 7 Oct 2023 5:50 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Dave Mudgett
From:
Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee
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Posted 26 Jul 2017 9:49 pm
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If putting it in backwards works for you, you should do it. But I have tried it this way and it feels awkward to me, and I suspect many others. For me, there are a few issues.
First, looking at the guitar set up upside-down in the case from the front of the case, the pedal bar obscures the view of the guts of what I'm setting up. Then I also have to reach around or over the top to assemble the guitar. If I work from the other side of the guitar/case, the top of the case obscures things in a similar way.
On the other hand, with the pedal bar to the rear of the case, there is a clear view of the guts and no obstruction to reaching in and setting things up. I don't find it awkward to either reach across to attach the pedal rods, nor do I find it awkward to take the steel out of the case this way. So I just don't see any advantage to setting it up backwards.
YMMV, no problem. I don't think it matters a hill of beans as long as it's set up correctly in the end. |
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Jack Stoner
From:
Kansas City, MO
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Posted 27 Jul 2017 2:30 am
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I've always used the opposite to you. That is the "normal" way. I worked for the Nashville Emmons dealer (at the time) and all the guitars that came in from the factory were packed with the pedal side "away". My Franklin, when it came new, was the same way and could not be placed in the case the opposite way due to the neck switch on the end. It would be the same way with Sho-Bud's since they have the neck switch on the end. All the steeler's that have been to our Florida Steel Guitar jams do it this way. I've never seen anyone do it your way.
_________________
GFI Ultra Keyless S-10 with pad (Black of course) TB202 amp, Hilton VP, Steelers Choice sidekick seat, SIT Strings
Cakewalk by Bandlab and Studio One V4.6 pro DAWs, MOTU Ultralite MK5 recording interface unit |
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Tim Russell
From:
Pennsylvania, USA
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Posted 27 Jul 2017 3:21 am
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I know it wouldn't for me, as the pedal bar is in the way, and reaching around or over it seems like a lot of work.
And then, detaching the pedal bar while it is facing away from you, working the attaching screws from the "inside"?
If your system works for you, that is great. I don't believe I've ever seen anyone else do it this way. Maybe you could post a video of the setup/tear-down process, maybe we could learn something.
_________________
Sierra Crown D-10 |
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Ian Rae
From:
Redditch, England
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Posted 27 Jul 2017 4:11 am
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Jim has the centre of gravity closer to his body when he lowers it in, which could be a long-term health benefit.
_________________
Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs |
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Bill Terry
From:
Bastrop, TX
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Posted 27 Jul 2017 6:31 am
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Didn't the Winnie Winston book have a section on 'how to assemble the guitar'? If that was where I saw it (can't check, my copy was lost), I think it showed the pedals away, as most have noted. I'm going on feeble memory, but I think it showed the player grabbing one front leg, and reaching to grab one back leg, which sounds awkward, but then you can rotate the guitar up and out without so much weight unevenly distributed, as when you grab both front or back legs. That's how I do it anywho..
But whatever works huh? Somebody should put up a YouTube video..  |
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Roy McKinney
From:
Ontario, OR
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Posted 27 Jul 2017 6:51 am
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| Page 12 in Winnie Winston book |
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Richard Sinkler
From:
aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
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Posted 27 Jul 2017 7:22 am
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| Bill Terry wrote: |
Didn't the Winnie Winston book have a section on 'how to assemble the guitar'? If that was where I saw it (can't check, my copy was lost), I think it showed the pedals away, as most have noted. I'm going on feeble memory, but I think it showed the player grabbing one front leg, and reaching to grab one back leg, which sounds awkward, but then you can rotate the guitar up and out without so much weight unevenly distributed, as when you grab both front or back legs. That's how I do it anywho..
But whatever works huh? Somebody should put up a YouTube video.. |
That's how I was told to do it. The reasoning was that when you grab both the front or back legs only, the weight gets distributed to to the point where the leg gets screwed into the end plate. Someone either at ZB, or Greg Lasser, ZB's bay area service rep, told me that. I did some work on a Fessenden one time, and one of the issues was the back leg at the the keyhead end wouldn't screw in correctly and would wobble a lot. The part of the end plate was cracked where the leg screwed in. I put a new end plate on for him. He admitted that he would pick up the guitar by the back legs.
_________________
Carter D10 8p/8k, Dekley S10 3p/4k C6 setup,Regal RD40 Dobro, NV400, NV112 . Playing for 54 years and still counting. |
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Tucker Jackson
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
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Posted 27 Jul 2017 9:53 am
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| Ian Rae wrote: |
| Jim has the centre of gravity closer to his body when he lowers it in, which could be a long-term health benefit. |
Yes, but only when putting it in the case. When setting it up on the floor -- a longer stretch -- the center of gravity is further from his body when doing that damaging bend-over move. Which could be bad on the back, long-term. |
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Ian Worley
From:
Sacramento, CA
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Posted 27 Jul 2017 11:05 am
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I put my Emmons' in the case "backwards" so that the public side, the front apron, isn't rubbing around on the bottom of the case. Which way to assemble the pedal bar or lift it out of the case seems pretty irrelevant to me.
It is important however, to wear a snappy suit like the guy in Winnie's book when setting up your steel. You'll play better too. |
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Bill Terry
From:
Bastrop, TX
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Posted 27 Jul 2017 11:53 am
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| Quote: |
| It is important however, to wear a snappy suit like the guy in Winnie's book when setting up your steel. |
Some things are just a given.. |
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Tony Prior
From:
Charlotte NC
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Posted 28 Jul 2017 3:13 am
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| Ian Worley wrote: |
I put my Emmons' in the case "backwards" so that the public side, the front apron, isn't rubbing around on the bottom of the case. Which way to assemble the pedal bar or lift it out of the case seems pretty irrelevant to me.
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Just wondering...I have never heard of this being an issue.
While it doesn't matter to me how anyone puts a Steel in a case or sets it up, I am wondering how the front apron may get scarred due to rubbing in the case. Only speaking for myself of course, after 40 years I have never observed this and I am not talking about just 1 Steel over the 4 decades. Multiple, many, probably 2 dozen or more !
3 right now...
Maybe the cases were wrong for the guitar ? I suspect if a manufacturer charged someone $5 grand and it arrived in a case with a scar on the front apron due to case rubbing or if the several thousand Steel owners experienced this, it would not sit well with the owners of said Instruments.
No ?
Just asking
_________________
Emmons L-II , Fender Telecasters, B-Benders
Pro Tools 12 on WIN 7 !
jobless- but not homeless- now retired 9 years
CURRENT MUSIC TRACKS AT > https://tprior2241.wixsite.com/website |
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Stu Schulman
From:
Ulster Park New Yawk (deceased)
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Posted 28 Jul 2017 5:20 am
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What Jack Stoner said!
_________________
Steeltronics Z-pickup,Desert Rose S-10 4+5,Desert Rose Keyless S-10 3+5... Mullen G2 S-10 3+5,Telonics 206 pickups,Telonics volume pedal.,Blanton SD -10,Emmons GS_10...Zirctone bar,Bill Groner Bar...any amp that isn't broken.Steel Seat.Com seats...Licking paint chips off of Chinese Toys since 1952. |
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Henry Matthews
From:
Texarkana, Ark USA
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Posted 28 Jul 2017 7:07 am
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I can't believe anyone would put a steel in case backwards. I have seen a few newbies do it just because they didn't know any better but that would be very awkward to me. Also putting the pedal rack backwards makes no sense but know a few that do that. If I do put my steel in it's case, which I very rarely do, it goes in pedal rack closest to lid and pedal rack fits in its compartment just like it came off steel and then rod and leg bag against it. I didn't know there was another way.
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Henry Matthews
D-10 Magnum, 8 &5, dark rose color
D-10 1974 Emmons cut tail, fat back,rosewood, 8&5
Nashville 112 amp, Fishman Loudbox Performer amp, Hilton pedal, Goodrich pedal,BJS bar, Kyser picks, Live steel Strings. No effects, doodads or stomp boxes. |
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Earnest Bovine
From:
Los Angeles CA USA
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Posted 28 Jul 2017 7:30 am
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| I saw Buddy Emmons do it backwards. He seemed confused. Alcohol may have been a factor. |
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Jonathan Shacklock
From:
London, UK
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Posted 28 Jul 2017 8:44 am
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I can think of one advantage: on the tiny stages or floor areas I usually play, the easiest way to load up is to set my case on top of the amp in the back line, turn round, pick up the steel which is still audience facing, flip it over, turn back around and put it in the case "backwards". Getting the guitar in the case the right way round almost always involves moving it AND the seat first, getting round the other side, then picking it up. Small difference but significant under cramped conditions or next-band-on time pressure. I loaded my mica MSA that way for several years.
Other than that I agree it's best to have a universal standard which may prevent damage to guitars in certain cases - and does make checking the underside/basic maintenance easier. |
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ajm
From:
Los Angeles
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Posted 29 Jul 2017 6:06 am
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A couple of comments.
Just to make it clear, the design of the cases are all the same. The compartment for the pedals, rods, etc is closest to you. The steel is in the compartment towards the back, and the case lid/cover is farthest away from you. So nothing out of the ordinary there.
In the attached link, at a couple of points Jim shows him setting up the guitar. See:
3:40
and especially 4:35
IMO, setup and tear down is MUCH easier on your back if you set the case on a chair or something to get it off of the ground. Not to mention the fact that it makes positioning the steel in the case much more precise.
In the video, with the case on the ground, it also requires that he kneel and/or bend over. IMO, more things to try to avoid. Of course, since he is probably much younger than most of us this isn't a factor for him......yet. ;>))
At 5:13, when he lifts it out of the case, he grabs two legs on the same side. I find it much easier to grab a leg on diagonal corners, especially when it comes time to "flip" or "roll" the steel into playing position.
That said, with him setting it up with the case on the ground, it *might* be easier at those angles as far as seeing things. I'm skeptical, though. YMMV.
In addition, the brand of steel could have something to do with it. The pedals/bars/rods may attach differently from brand to brand. I noticed that he is using a GFI.
All that said, IMO opinion it's much easier to:
- Raise the case up off of the ground for setup and tear down so things are closer to eye level, and
- Have it in the case the "normal" way, that being with the pedal bar farthest from you.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xv2ASLSgRPM |
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Bobby Boggs
From:
Upstate SC.
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Posted 29 Jul 2017 7:25 am
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| Quote: |
| Just to make it clear, the design of the cases are all the same. |
Sorry that's not true. If your guitar rides on the bottom of the case.No blocks. Or if it's blocked so the guitar rest on the top and rear. (The area near the necks.) Most of the later Zum cases are made that way. It's probably ok to place in the case backwards. But many cases for D-10's are blocked, (in the bottom) to compensate for the height distance between the top and lower deck. If you place the guitar in backwards. It will rock more when transported.
b. |
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ajm
From:
Los Angeles
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Posted 29 Jul 2017 4:22 pm
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Bobby: I was only considering flat bottom and top cases. I was not aware of the type that you are talking about. Therefore, a person could put the steel in with the changer on either the right or left side and it wouldn't make any difference.
I believe that is the case with the OP. If not, hopefully he will reply back, wondering why his steel always rocks and rolls in the case and doesn't fit snugly.
For the situation that you are talking about, hopefully someone would figure out rather quickly that they have the guitar installed turned around. |
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Jack Stoner
From:
Kansas City, MO
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Posted 30 Jul 2017 2:24 am
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As I previously noted, I can only put my steel in the case one way. There are end blocks and space on the left side for the neck switch on the end of the guitar. Trying to put it in backwards would damage (break off) the neck switch handle.
The case that came with my 71 PP D-10 Emmons was blocked and the guitar would only fit one way because of the blocks that kept the guitar off the bottom of the case.
_________________
GFI Ultra Keyless S-10 with pad (Black of course) TB202 amp, Hilton VP, Steelers Choice sidekick seat, SIT Strings
Cakewalk by Bandlab and Studio One V4.6 pro DAWs, MOTU Ultralite MK5 recording interface unit |
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Don R Brown
From:
Rochester, New York, USA
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Posted 30 Jul 2017 6:03 am
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This probably is like the question of which way the toilet paper roll should be placed, dropping down from behind or unrolling over the top toward you. But I always put mine in with the pedals toward the latch end of the case, not the hinge part.
First, having been taught to grasp diagonally opposite legs means I have to "bow" and lean over the steel for that. When I stand behind the steel (same side as I play from) my feet are under it, while if facing it from the "audience" side the pedal bar limits my feet farther away. This is harder on the back.
Second, when the instrument is sitting in the case, I find it easier to install/remove the pedal bar and the rods when they are right next to me, rather than on the other side. Dave Mudgett does have a valid point about the pedal bar becoming an obstruction for seeing what you are doing but to me it's easier to have the rods closer to me rather than working across the instrument.
IMHO, unless you have a one-way-only case, it's whatever works best for you. |
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Charley Bond
From:
Inola, OK, USA
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Posted 30 Jul 2017 7:47 am Puttin it in wrong..?
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As long as I have been around Pedal Steels, I've always put the Pedal Bar at the back, kinda like what has been described here, many times.
But, if there's anything I've learned in 74.8 years, it's this. We live in a Chocolate & Vanilla world, we all may do the same thing in a different manner.
Who's right, we all are, because we do what we do, because that's how we do it.
_________________
Steel Guitar players are members of a Special Family |
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Bobby Boggs
From:
Upstate SC.
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Posted 30 Jul 2017 8:10 pm
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| Quote: |
This probably is like the question of which way the toilet paper roll should be placed, |
For me, it's more like which way the toilet seat should be installed. It just wouldn't feel right. 
But, even if I wanted to place mine in the case backwards. I would suffer damage such as Jack Stoner mentioned.
b. |
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Tony Prior
From:
Charlotte NC
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Posted 31 Jul 2017 3:57 am
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I never thought about reversing it, don't think I ever will.
What would be the reason ?
_________________
Emmons L-II , Fender Telecasters, B-Benders
Pro Tools 12 on WIN 7 !
jobless- but not homeless- now retired 9 years
CURRENT MUSIC TRACKS AT > https://tprior2241.wixsite.com/website |
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Tim Tyner
From:
Ayden, North Carolina U.S.A
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Posted 31 Jul 2017 12:10 pm
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| I am with Tony on this one! |
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