Is my steel guitar doomed?

Storm Rosson · From: Silver City, NM. USA

I guess what I was aiming at was Daves reference to cleaning and sanding the old glue before applying any more. So what I'm gettin at is a response to Daves thoughts and the answer is NO you aren't glueing over the old glue as it appears to still be holding. Any cracks I can see are in virgin territory ,emphasis on "any cracks I can see" as we haven't had the dubious pleasure of seeing the whole body in the nude (weird choice of words eh?) Question

Mitch Ellis · From: Collins, Mississippi USA

Jerry Roller · From: Van Buren, Arkansas USA

Dave, is it a lacquered body or mica?
Jerry
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Dave Stroud · From: Texas

It WAS mica, now it's glue traces Very Happy

Jerry Roller · From: Van Buren, Arkansas USA

My thoughts were if you didn't wish to repair it you could just replace one neck of the body if it was mica. Nothing wrong with the other neck.
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Dave Stroud · From: Texas

As I was sanding down the body, I could feel a little give in the middle right where the crack was. It was very slight, but noticeable. I haven't been rough on the body while working on it. I applied a little bit of pressure and it split right down the middle. It was an awfully weak glue job. I'm not too happy about not knowing anything about this crack before I bought it.

I've sanded down the edges where the old glue/wood slats(?) traces are to re-glue it. The tricky part is clamping it down for a straight fit. Any suggestions?

Jerry Roller · From: Van Buren, Arkansas USA

If you are going to cover it with mica you could lay plastic sheet on a table top or flat plywood and screw it down to the flat surface for straight fit and fill screw holes later.
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Billy Carr · From: Seminary, Mississippi, USA (deceased)

Never had this problem before but will put in my .02 . Think I'd just remove all of the parts and send it all to JF, after talking to him if he's willing to build a guitar. He may have a cabinet available. Jerry's a good man and builds a nice guitar. I've had 4 or 5 Fessy's over the years. Good luck.

David Nugent · From: Gum Spring, Va.

Being the party that sold this guitar to Dave, I feel an obligation to chime in here. Had I been aware of any existing structural damage I certainly would not have offered the unit for sale without full disclosure. I was under the assumption that the damage had occurred from improper handling by Fedex. I sincerely regret that any transaction that I have been involved in, especially through this Forum, has not ended in 100% satisfaction. Dave, if I can be of assistance in any way, please do not hesitate to contact me.

Dave Stroud · From: Texas

David,

I know well of your honesty, and I would feel 100% confident in dealing with you again. I had no intentions of disclosing where I got the guitar from, because I know you didn't have any idea about this crack. The rest of this reply isn't directed towards you, or anyone else in particular.

I'm a tad dissapointed that a previous owner didn't feel it was important to mention it, but I also give them the benefit of a doubt that they honestly felt the crack was repaired and didn't need any mentioning. (To be clear- I don't know all the previous owners, and I'm not very interested either). I feel that any major repair to an instrument should be disclosed- even if it seems like the repaired area is no longer an issue.

The reason for this is because an instrument with a major repair will fetch different prices depending on who made the repair. If the repair was made by a reputable builder, you might still have to knock off $100-$200 what they typically go for when it's time to sell. If the repair was done in the garage of handy-man Joe with some old glue lying around, the price might be knocked down $300-$400 what it would've been sold for before the damaged occured. I'm just estimating, but it seems like it would be around that ball park, maybe more. A structurally repaired instrument of any kind can be tough to sell.

A solid glue-joint repair shouldn't break loose. The wood should break before the glue. Upon inspecting the joint after it broke, I could see that the glue job wasn't near professional.

Because information wasn't disclosed at some point, the tab has been sent to me in the form of a few options:

1.) I glue the joint myself and sell it at a discount from what I bought it for, or

2.) I buy a new body

I'm not angry- but I want to raise awareness of these situations so people can avoid these delimmas and deal fairly with others.

Don R Brown · From: Rochester, New York, USA

I don't know any of the people involved here, but would like to point out another scenario which COULD have taken place.

Say "A" owns the steel and for whatever reason the repair is made. If "A" passes away, "B" might buy it without discovering the repair, and subsequently sell it to "C" who discovers the issue. Or it could go to "D", "E" or any number of owners if none of them look closely.

Alternatively, "A" could have traded it to a music store with full disclosure, but after X months (or years) it gets sold by some other employee with no knowledge of the defect.

You can probably make up even more scenarios if you want. My point is that stuff happens, and it is possible for a seller to have total integrity yet unknowingly sell a flawed instrument.

J R Rose · From: Keota, Oklahoma, USA

It can be repaired well but it may turned into a big job. If it was mine I would take it completely apart and clean off the flocking and make sure you get the glue into the crack and the most important thing is to use a bar clamp or more than one to squeeze it together very good. Let set 24 hours or more. Elmer's white carpenter's glue will hold very well but it has to be CLAMPED. I am an old carpenter/repair person and have rebuilt, repaired & refinished many musical instruments in my time and built a half dozen single neck steels. I still rehair fiddle bows now and then. Good Luck, J.R.
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NOTHING..Sold it all. J.R. Rose

Dave Stroud · From: Texas

Thanks for all the ideas and help. I got a long piece of wood about the size of the gap between the two necks and sanded it down to size. I used titebond II and about 12 clamps all along the body. I left it clamped for 24 hrs.

It seems to be holding up well and staying in tune.

Broken Crying or Very sad

Before and after sanding off the broken seam.

Fixed body and all parts. I cleaned up the changer parts really well and used some tri-flow.

Laying down the mica.

All finished after many many hours. I took off 5 pedals for the time being because I'm gonna focus on E9 for a while. I also added a franklin pedal at the 4th in my copedent. The tri-flow works really well, those pedals are extremely smooth.

I'm learning Mike Johnson's "Joan Marie" to celebrate.

Jerry Overstreet · From: Louisville Ky

I take my hat off to you. A major undertaking of complete disassembly including body halves and repair. Not for the faint of heart.

It's unfortunate that this happened to you, but now you have something you can be more than proud of with your own personal touch.

Great documentation and identification of parts. Looks like you'll be in the market for some more post-its too Exclamation

Great job and best of luck pickin'.

J R Rose · From: Keota, Oklahoma, USA

Great Job Dave. Looks beautiful. You should be very proud of yourself. Doing something like that yourself gives you a sense of PRIDE like nothing else. Again,Good Job. J.R.
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NOTHING..Sold it all. J.R. Rose

john widgren · From: Wilton CT

Nice work! Congratulations. FWIW classical instrument repair experts will leave evidence (to the trained eye) of repair work. I have done some cabinet repairs and I do the same thing. Leaving discreet evidence of good repair work keeps things honest when it comes to potential re-sale of a used and repaired instrument. Also, the kind of photo documentation you show is great too. If I ever see evidence that a repair is concealed or covered up, it always raises questions, and often puts me off an instrument. Honest clean and discreetly traceable repair work, or photo documentation is a good policy when it comes to repairs. Well done.
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