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Topic: Tuning for Fender 400 |
Bill Miller
From:
Gaspe, Quebec, Canada
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Posted 27 Dec 2016 6:17 pm |
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| Can someone tell me what tuning was on the Fender 400 originally and what the most common tuning is for those guitars today? I need some background. |
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Michael Lee Allen
From:
Portage Park / Irving Park, Chicago, Illinois
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Posted 28 Dec 2016 7:08 am
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| Original factory tuning and instruction manual for a 400 were A6th, low to high F# A C# E F# A C# E. For a 1000 (doubleneck) it would have been A6th and E7th. Nowadays most people who'd want to play "retro country" on one of these would probably use the first 8 strings of the E9th tuning but lowered to Eb9th, D9th, or Db9th to minimize string breakage. |
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Michael Maddex
From:
Northern New Mexico, USA
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Tim Whitlock
From:
Colorado, USA
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Posted 28 Dec 2016 8:43 am
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Here is the tuning chart from the early Fender 1000 Manual. Fender recommended A6 for the Fender 400 which corresponds to the "First Neck" tuning in the chart below. The pulls for 6 pedals are shown along with the chords that are produced. I will try to post the pages from the manual that show combinations of pedals - it's a pretty comprehensive list and employs both feet. I tuned my Fender 1000 to this and I find it to be great for swing or Hawaiian music. Another interesting thing I noted is that I can retune to C6 and some of the pedals automatically translate to usable pulls. If you want to PM me I can send you the whole Fender 1000 manual file.
Last edited by Tim Whitlock on 28 Dec 2016 8:57 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Tim Whitlock
From:
Colorado, USA
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Posted 28 Dec 2016 8:53 am
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Thanks for the links Michael! I love my 58 Fender 1000, too, and just purchased a '63 in showroom condition. It should be noted that the manual on the Fender site is for the 1967 Fender 400. This guitar had a 23" scale as opposed to the 24.5" scale on the early models. It also has the cam style bridge saddles instead of the straight bar bridge. Both of these factors are crucial to what tunings and string gauges are best to use |
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Bill Miller
From:
Gaspe, Quebec, Canada
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Posted 28 Dec 2016 9:19 am
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Thanks for the info. This is for a guy who is completely new to pedal guitars and recently picked up an old Fender 400, not really knowing anything about it except that it was a pedal steel guitar. I have the impression that he will be more interested in playing classic country than any of the styles I think of as associated with A6. I've not yet seen the guitar but he told me it is supposed to be tuned to C6 at present.
I think his best bet may be to send the guitar to someone like Al Brisco at Steel Guitars of Canada and have him set it up with a D9 tuning. That way if he later decides to get a modern S10 E9 guitar he will have some foundation to build on. There is just so much more learning material for a modern pedal steel, both online and from books and DVD courses. Any thoughts or suggestions? |
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Tim Whitlock
From:
Colorado, USA
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Posted 28 Dec 2016 2:47 pm
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If he wants to learn E9 style PSG then I agree he would probably need to tune his 400 to D9 (unless it is the later version with the cam style bridge saddles). The nice thing about a 400 is the guitar is very simple to understand and you can change the setup from C6 to D9 pretty easily. You just slap on a set of E9 strings and connect your cables to the changer fingers underneath. The changer fingers with springs are the lowers and the other ones are the raises. The tuning screws are at the end of the guitar - black screws adjust the lowers and the silver screws adjust the raises.
He'll have to decide which 8 strings he wants to use out of the modern 10 string E9 tuning. Some folks use the top 8 strings (including the two chromatics). I think most 400 players tend to use the bottom 8. Once you decide which strings you want to use, you can put them on and start moving your cables.
Unfortunately, most of the learning materials available are for a modern 10 string E9 guitar with at least 3 floor pedals and two knee levers. It's challenging to translate these lessons to a D9 eight string setup, but one can still pick up a lot, especially if you have an experienced player to help you. |
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David Neslony
From:
Arlington, TX USA
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Posted 12 Nov 2017 9:05 am
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I would put an F# as string 1 (on E9th).
...........................................Add Homemade Knee Levers
1. F#
2. G# --------A
3. E---------------F#---------D#(KL)---D(KL)
4. B----C#--------C#
5. G#---------A
6. F#
7. E---------------------------D#(KL)
8. B----C#-----------------------------D(Kl)
From the 2nd string down, what you have is strings 3 through 7 of a 12 string E9/B6 Universal tuning.
You can lower all strings a half tone (1 fret) or a whole tone (2 frets) to minimize string breakage. |
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b0b
From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
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Ian Worley
From:
Sacramento, CA
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Posted 12 Nov 2017 11:05 am
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| Nope, the stops are tuned within the changer mechanism, one raised note and one lowered note. You could rig some sort of half stop on the pull side, but it would be very imprecise because of the inherent looseness of the cable mechanism unless it was directly attached to the puller on the changer. You can of course have multiple pedals pulling the same note though |
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Jim Sliff
From:
Lawndale California, USA
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Posted 12 Nov 2017 11:12 pm
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| Quote: |
| Can the changer mechanism actually do double raises and double lowers? |
Not without a little trick modification. Many of us use Shobud barrel stops or another similar "stop" on a cable to facilitate double raises or lowers. It does take unsoldering-resoldering one cable for each one, which takes a bit of special knowledge - but it's not hard to do if you have a bit of mechanical know-how.
Several images of "double raise/lower" mechanisms and a document I wrote up detailing soldering operations are posted on the Facebook Fender Pedal Steel page if anyone is interested.
_________________
No chops, but great tone
1930's/40's Rickenbacher/Rickenbacker 6&8 string lap steels
1921 Weissenborn Style 2; Hilo&Schireson hollownecks
Appalachian, Regal & Dobro squarenecks
1959 Fender 400 9+2 B6;1960's Fender 800 3+3+2; 1948 Fender Dual-8 Professional |
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b0b
From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
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tom anderson
From:
leawood, ks., usa
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Posted 14 Nov 2017 11:02 am B-6 tuning
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I use Sneaky Pete’s B-6 tuning, well at least partof it since I only have 6 pedals. No string breakage, great sound from the Fender pick up and try and play along with the early Linda Rondstadt, Jackson Brown albums he was on. It’s all there and either very classic country or country rock. The only change I made from Bob’s Copedient is I increased the diameter of the 4th F# string from 022 to 026 to stop the string buzzing at the first fret. The tuning is taking getting used to and I haven’t taken it out to play but I will when I am more comfortable. Drop the E-9/D-9 stuff.
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