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Topic: 6th string won't lower from G# to F# |
Alan Michael
From: Winston-Salem North Carolina U.S.A.
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Posted 24 Jun 2015 12:19 pm
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I just picked up a nice little Sho-Bud Pro I and I've been busy switching things around to my preferred copedent. The only problem I'm having is getting the 6th string to lower a full step to F#. It has a plain string and the pull rod is at the lowest hole (nearest to the pedals) on the bellcrank and the highest hole (nearest to the bottom of the cabinet) on the changer. The changer is the 3 raise, 2 lower changer of the late model Pro I. Any suggestions? |
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Lane Gray
From: Topeka, KS
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Posted 24 Jun 2015 12:41 pm
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When was the last time it saw a drop of oil? I bet the raise finger is moving along with the lower.
This makes them cancel each other out.
Watch the fingers as you move the lever.
The Bud finger has three rivets per string, they all need to move free _________________ 2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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Martin Weenick
From: Lecanto, FL, USA
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Posted 24 Jun 2015 1:10 pm
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Check out what Lane said, you may have to move your knee lever stop screw out some so you can get more travel with your lever. _________________ Several custom steels. NV-112 Boss DD-7 |
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Jim Palenscar
From: Oceanside, Calif, USA
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Posted 24 Jun 2015 9:35 pm
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Frequently in my experience it is the raise helper spring that is the culprit as it allows the raise to occur simultaneously w the lower so you can be chasing your tail so-to-speak. When that occurs I will usually remove the spring altogether- sometimes in an unceremonious fashion as they can be difficult to unhook from the changer. Also- sometimes the fulcrum doesn't work as well closest to the changer axle so you might use the one further away and also insure that there is adequate travel in the lever as has been said. |
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Alan Michael
From: Winston-Salem North Carolina U.S.A.
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Posted 25 Jun 2015 7:45 am
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In reading all the replies to my post, I've decided to pull the changer today and give it a good cleaning and lube..That way I can at least eliminate the possibility of the fingers being gunked up. If that doesn't solve my problem then I can move to the next option. Is there a preferred solvent and procedure for cleaning the changer? |
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Lane Gray
From: Topeka, KS
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Posted 25 Jun 2015 7:49 am
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Naphtha and a toothbrush, Meguiar's Cleaner Wax and soft cloths. Those work well.
Take lots of pictures.
DON'T lube the barrels. _________________ 2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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Alan Michael
From: Winston-Salem North Carolina U.S.A.
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Posted 25 Jun 2015 8:00 am
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Not sure what you mean by don't lube the barrels. My pull rods have retainer clips if that is what you're referring to. |
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Alan Michael
From: Winston-Salem North Carolina U.S.A.
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Posted 25 Jun 2015 8:00 am
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Not sure what you mean by don't lube the barrels. My pull rods have retainer clips if that is what you're referring to. |
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Lane Gray
From: Topeka, KS
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Posted 25 Jun 2015 8:01 am
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While you're at it, you might as well take your polish of choice to the tailpiece. _________________ 2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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Richard Sinkler
From: aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
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Posted 25 Jun 2015 8:03 am
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Sounds like he has the "Super-Pro" type of undercarriage with the pot metal parts. _________________ Carter D10 8p/8k, Dekley S10 3p/4k C6 setup,Regal RD40 Dobro, NV400, NV112 . Playing for 54 years and still counting. |
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Lane Gray
From: Topeka, KS
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Posted 25 Jun 2015 8:05 am
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You said you had a Pro I.
It has apparently been modified (I'm not convinced that updates are upgrades), as Pro I means barrels behind two-hole pullers and the single-single changer. _________________ 2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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Alan Michael
From: Winston-Salem North Carolina U.S.A.
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Posted 25 Jun 2015 8:09 am
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Sorry for the confusion, my bad. It is a Pro I, 1978 with 3 raises, 2 lowers, and pot metal components. Is this the Super Pro undercarriage? |
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Lane Gray
From: Topeka, KS
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Posted 25 Jun 2015 8:12 am
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Hex shafts? _________________ 2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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Alan Michael
From: Winston-Salem North Carolina U.S.A.
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Posted 25 Jun 2015 8:14 am
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Yes, hex shafts. |
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Richard Sinkler
From: aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
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Posted 25 Jun 2015 8:15 am
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If I'm not mistaken, the last of the Pro series guitars started using the pot metal undercarriage, as I think (not real positive) I have seen some Pro 2 and Pro 3 guitars on here with pot metal undercarriages. _________________ Carter D10 8p/8k, Dekley S10 3p/4k C6 setup,Regal RD40 Dobro, NV400, NV112 . Playing for 54 years and still counting. |
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Lane Gray
From: Topeka, KS
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Posted 25 Jun 2015 8:31 am
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I'm less familiar with those fingers.
Make thorough notes of which holes each end of each rod is in, take lots of pictures. Have fun and try not to get frustrated. _________________ 2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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Brint Hannay
From: Maryland, USA
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Posted 25 Jun 2015 9:33 am
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I believe there were lots of Pro I, Pro II, and Pro III guitars made with the "Super Pro" mechanics. The model names didn't change when the mechanics did; the Super Pro was just added to the product line around the same time, leading to the handy informal "Super Pro" tag for those mechanics.
(Not sure at what point (or why) they started adding "Custom" to the Pro series decals.) |
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John Billings
From: Ohio, USA
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Posted 25 Jun 2015 4:22 pm
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" I will usually remove the spring altogether"
Coop told me to do that. _________________ Dr. Z Surgical Steel amp, amazing!
"74 Bud S-10 3&6
'73 Bud S-10 3&5(under construction)
'63 Fingertip S-10, at James awaiting 6 knees
'57 Strat, LP Blue
'91 Tele with 60's Maple neck
Dozen more guitars!
Dozens of amps, but SF Quad reverb, Rick Johnson cabs. JBL 15, '64 Vibroverb for at home.
'52 and '56 Pro Amps |
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Alan Michael
From: Winston-Salem North Carolina U.S.A.
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Posted 25 Jun 2015 5:18 pm
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Well I pulled the changer fingers and they were a cruddy mess. So I've got the changer and springs and a few other parts taking a naptha bath. And since I've got the pull rods removed I've decided to go ahead and clean the whole thing up. I figure I'm halfway there so why not. I might even decide to get rid of the pot metal and upgrade to the better components. While I'm at it does anyone know where I can get my hands on a stock Sho-Bud single coil pickup. |
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Lane Gray
From: Topeka, KS
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Posted 25 Jun 2015 7:23 pm
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James Morehead, or Jerry Wallace will wind you a Truetone with a tap. _________________ 2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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Tony Prior
From: Charlotte NC
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Posted 26 Jun 2015 1:48 am
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Pro I does not imply old style changer and pull system. My Pro 1 is the latest SB design, cast 5 hole hex pullers with spring clips as well as NON Gumby Headstock. The issue is most likely related to the lever stop screw, not enough lever throw. If the pull rod changer position and the bell crank position is at the MOST pull position,just simply add some more lever throw.
Cleaning the changer is an excellent thing but it will not fix this. It's a combination of changer/rod/bell crank position, lever set screw adjustment and string gauge. Lighter gauge strings require more throw, heavier gauge strings require less throw, don't rule that out. This is a mechanical issue.
_________________ Emmons L-II , Fender Telecasters, B-Benders
Pro Tools 12 on WIN 7 !
jobless- but not homeless- now retired 9 years
CURRENT MUSIC TRACKS AT > https://tprior2241.wixsite.com/website |
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Lane Gray
From: Topeka, KS
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Posted 26 Jun 2015 7:20 am
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When they get gunky, the raise finger often goes along for the ride.
In fact, not going to F# is usually the first indication that it's oil time.
I always check that the raise finger isn't going along. _________________ 2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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Alan Michael
From: Winston-Salem North Carolina U.S.A.
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Posted 26 Jun 2015 7:30 am
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Tony, the first thing I did was to back off on the stop thinking that would solve my problem but it still would not lower a full step. I think a gunked up changer is probably the culprit but I'll know more when I get her back together. The string gauge and the helper spring will be something to think about as well. In seeing the awful condition oil and grease has left the underside of this guitar in, I'm thinking about lubing everything up with Tri-flow when I reassemble, Any thoughts?
Lane, I think you're on the right track here. When I would engage the lever the string would lower about a half step and then actually begin to raise the pitch a bit. |
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Earnest Bovine
From: Los Angeles CA USA
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Posted 26 Jun 2015 8:24 am
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Alan Michael wrote: |
I'll know more when I get her back together. |
Before you put the rods back, test the G# string to see how far it can lower. There is no sense in trying to do it with pull rods if the changer can't move that far. |
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Brint Hannay
From: Maryland, USA
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Posted 26 Jun 2015 9:24 am
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...
Last edited by Brint Hannay on 26 Jun 2015 9:33 am; edited 1 time in total |
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