| What do you prefer for the 1st string of C6th? |
| G |
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33% |
[ 38 ] |
| D |
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66% |
[ 76 ] |
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| Total Votes : 114 |
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| Author |
Topic: 10 String C6th - D or G? |
Mike Perlowin
From:
Los Angeles CA
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Ian Rae
From:
Redditch, England
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Posted 17 Jan 2015 2:07 am |
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Or 12 so you can have low D as well? There would be benefits to having 12 strings on the E9 as well. Wait - I've invented the D12!
_________________
Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs |
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Paul Crawford
From:
Orlando, Fl
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Posted 17 Jan 2015 7:23 am
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| I actually have both, D on the Emmons & G on the Zum. If I'm putting the steel up front as the main solo instrument, I use the D all the time in the melody. But if I'm backing a group then I just love the G voicing and hardly ever use the D for chords. I like grabbing that high note without running past the 15th fret to get it, particularly for tunes in the key of C. |
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Bob Watson
From:
Champaign, Illinois, U.S.
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Posted 17 Jan 2015 9:28 pm
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| I started out with the G and then went to the D when it became popular to do so. I never really liked it as much and about 10 years ago I went back to the G. If I had the C# knee lever I'd go back to the D on the 1st string, but if its got to be one or the other, I like the G better. |
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Jerry Roller
From:
Van Buren, Arkansas USA
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Posted 17 Jan 2015 10:59 pm
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I use a D because it enables a lot of nice single string lines. Can't play Pete Drake stuff on it though.
Jerry
_________________
http://www.littleoprey.org/ |
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Paul Hoaglin
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Posted 18 Jan 2015 1:47 pm
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| Mike Perlowin wrote: |
| Why don't double neck guitars come with 11 string on the C6 neck so you can have both? |
As the kids say, "this"! 
(Big fan, by the way, Mike. I love the 20th Century composers - huge on BartΓΒ³k and Stravinsky especially - and you do them all wonderfully. Thread derail - sorry....) |
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Richard Sinkler
From:
aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
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Posted 18 Jan 2015 4:02 pm
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I think a lot of players, like me, thought the G sounded weak and whimpy. But I don't use the D very much, and think the G would be more useful at times. That's why I would like a twelve string.
_________________
Carter D10 8p/8k, Dekley S10 3p/4k C6 setup,Regal RD40 Dobro, NV400, NV112 . Playing for 54 years and still counting. |
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John Swain
From:
Winchester, Va
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Posted 18 Jan 2015 4:35 pm
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| I bought my first D10 Emmons in 1975 and because Buddy and Paul were already proponents for the D on top, I learned that way. I find beside the single note work the chord work is easier and allows full chords without using two feet( with standard pedals!) To this day, the only pro players I know of who stayed with the G were Herbie and Tommy Roots. Also the advantage of having the 9th on the first string on both tunings allows more similarities than differences. JS |
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b0b
From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
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Posted 18 Jan 2015 4:42 pm
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| Mike Perlowin wrote: |
| Why don't double neck guitars come with 11 string on the C6 neck so you can have both? |
Because the high G isn't necessary if you have a C# knee lever.
_________________
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Paul Hoaglin
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Posted 18 Jan 2015 5:15 pm
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| b0b wrote: |
| Mike Perlowin wrote: |
| Why don't double neck guitars come with 11 string on the C6 neck so you can have both? |
Because the high G isn't necessary if you have a C# knee lever. |
It is if you want to play "Bluemmons"! (And I do....) |
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John Alexander
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Posted 18 Jan 2015 6:58 pm
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| b0b wrote: |
| Mike Perlowin wrote: |
| Why don't double neck guitars come with 11 string on the C6 neck so you can have both? |
Because the high G isn't necessary if you have a C# knee lever. |
I don't see it that way. One of the things I have most often used the high G for is the G6/Em7 you can get with a four-note grip on strings 1,3,4 and 6 with traditional pedal 7 down. Its especially useful for creating harmonized melodic sequences over a series of chords using similar voicings.
There are also nice chords voicings available using the same grip and traditional pedal 4, or pedals 5 and 6 together, or pedals 6 and 7 together, pedal 6 alone, or the C to C# alone or with pedal 4.
If you lower the 5th string to F it is really nice to have the G on top for major 9 minor 11 chords, and in combination with the 3rd string lowered to B, a nice G13, and if you can flat the 4th string to Ab, a Gb913.
I'm translating from Bb6 here, so hope the above is correctly translated. There are some differences. |
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Richard Sinkler
From:
aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
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Posted 18 Jan 2015 7:23 pm
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| b0b wrote: |
| Mike Perlowin wrote: |
| Why don't double neck guitars come with 11 string on the C6 neck so you can have both? |
Because the high G isn't necessary if you have a C# knee lever. |
But what about us who don't have, or want, the C # lever?
_________________
Carter D10 8p/8k, Dekley S10 3p/4k C6 setup,Regal RD40 Dobro, NV400, NV112 . Playing for 54 years and still counting. |
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b0b
From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
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Posted 18 Jan 2015 11:56 pm
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| John Alexander wrote: |
I'm translating from Bb6 here, so hope the above is correctly translated. There are some differences. |
In Bb6 the string is tuned to F - thicker gauge, different timbre. If I played Bb6, I'd want a high F because otherwise my highest string would only be D. Too low.
_________________
-πππ- (admin) - Robert P. Lee - Recordings - Breathe - D6th - Video |
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John Alexander
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Posted 19 Jan 2015 1:50 am
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| b0b wrote: |
| John Alexander wrote: |
I'm translating from Bb6 here, so hope the above is correctly translated. There are some differences. |
In Bb6 the string is tuned to F - thicker gauge, different timbre. If I played Bb6, I'd want a high F because otherwise my highest string would only be D. Too low. |
The Bb6 tuning I'm talking about is the Bb6 universal tuning, which by virtue of its 12 strings doesn't have the dilemma being discussed here. With respect to the utility of chords mentioned in my previous post the difference between the Bb6 and C6 tunings in the timbre of their string gauges doesn't seem particularly significant to me. |
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Roger Shackelton
From:
MINNESOTA (deceased)
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Posted 19 Jan 2015 6:54 am
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Curly Chalker must have really been stymied, since he didn't have a high G or a D string. 
Roger |
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Richard Sinkler
From:
aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
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Posted 19 Jan 2015 10:12 am
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Yeah... We all know how "bad" Curly played. Yeah... I kept hearing how "BAD-assed" of a player he was.
_________________
Carter D10 8p/8k, Dekley S10 3p/4k C6 setup,Regal RD40 Dobro, NV400, NV112 . Playing for 54 years and still counting. |
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Larry Bressington
From:
Nebraska
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Posted 20 Jan 2015 10:54 am
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I much prefer a (G), however most instructional stuff is heavily dependent on the (D) for fast and colourful solo lines.
I would much prefer (G) for western swing, but if I was going after the Emmons, Franklin speed style of playing, I'd have a (D).
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A.K.A Chappy. |
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Larry Lenhart
From:
Ponca City, Oklahoma
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Posted 21 Jan 2015 2:36 pm
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I use the "G" on the 1st string...coming from non pedal steel roots on C6th...it just seems natural to me for western swing, which is what I play the most on C6th.
_________________
Zum Encore, Remington D8 non pedal, Hallmark Mosrite clone, Gretsch 6120 DSW, Gretsch G5210T-P90 Electromatic Jet Two 90,1976 Ibanez L5, Eastman archtop, Taylor Dreadnaught, Telonics pedal, Squire Tele, Squire Strat, Fender Tonemaster, Gold Tone 5 string banjo, Little Wonder tenor banjo, 3 Roland cubes 30s and 80, Carvin combo bass amp |
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Carl Mesrobian
From:
Salem, Massachusetts, USA
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Posted 25 Nov 2015 10:55 am
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Nothing like bumping an old post. I use D on top, and G on top on my 8 string - Just have to remind my 65 y.o. brain about it, or the first flub on that string reminds me.
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--carl
"The better it gets, the fewer of us know it." Ray Brown |
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Herb Steiner
From:
Spicewood TX 78669
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Posted 25 Nov 2015 12:04 pm
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I remember the very day I decided to switch to a D string, no lie.
It was in Nashville during DJ Convention in October of 1977. I was in the Bill Lawrence room at the Andrew Jackson Hotel listening to Bill pontificate about something or other. Paul Franklin Jr. and Mike Smith came in and we started conversing and talking about tunings. Paul said, and I quote  , "a D string is mandatory there if you want to play modern music, or in a minor key."
There are rare situations where a G note is handy there and the C-C# change doesn't apply, such as when you need the open string to be a G when doing hammer-ons. This topic came up just the other day in a thread about deciphering a Buddy lick from the early 60s.
_________________
My rig: Infinity and Telonics.
Son, we live in a world with walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with steel guitars. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinberg? |
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Paddy Long
From:
Christchurch, New Zealand
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Posted 25 Nov 2015 4:50 pm
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I have always been a D on top bloke ! 
_________________
14'Zumsteel Hybrid D10 9+9
08'Zumsteel Hybrid D10 9+9
94' Franklin Stereo D10 9+8
Telonics, Peterson, Steelers Choice, Benado, Lexicon, Red Dirt Cases. |
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Ian Rae
From:
Redditch, England
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Posted 26 Nov 2015 4:43 am
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Why not have a D - G change? I have heard of players tuning the G string down to D for certain songs. Already individual strings often cover a range of a major third, so a fourth is not such a stretch (pun intended). A lockable lever, maybe?
_________________
Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs |
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Christopher Woitach
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
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Posted 27 Nov 2015 7:54 am
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Like John I play a Bb6 12 string universal - 1st string is a C (C6 D), 2nd G, 3rd F
The only disadvantage is reaching for that reentrant string, but my RKR lowers the 4th to C to make it easier when I need it
_________________
Christopher Woitach
cw@affmusic.com
www.affmusic.com |
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Ian Rae
From:
Redditch, England
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Posted 27 Nov 2015 1:27 pm
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On my B6 uni, instead of tuning my 2nd string to D# and lowering it, I tune it to C# and raise it, which makes no difference to E9 playing (as long as I remember) and it serves for the 1st string D (in C6-speak). The only downside is that instead of being out in front where it's easy to grab, it's between two strings I'm not using and need not to hit.
At present, I hit it cleanly more than 50% of the time, which gives me heart that it will become reliable with further practice.
_________________
Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs |
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John McClung
From:
Olympia WA, USA
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Posted 27 Nov 2015 4:33 pm
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My Mullen D12's back neck is an 11-string C6, with high G as string 3, D as string 2 and I used to have and F as string 1 (yielding C-D-E-F-G on strings 1 thru 5 played out of order), but Rick Schmidt talked me into letting that F go. So I have both notes, D and G, plus low G# and E on the E9 neck, thus my preference for the flexibility and range of a D12. D11 would be next best thing.
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βͺοΈ If you want to have an ongoing discussion, please email me, don't use the Forum messaging which I detest! steelguitarlessons@earthlink.net |
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