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Topic: So I wanna learn the pedal steel........ |
Peter Harrell
From:
North Carolina, USA
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Posted 31 Jul 2014 9:30 am |
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Hi guys. First, I should introduce myself. I build racing engines for a living but I have gigged as a saxophone player(uneducated) for 20 years or so. Recently I have developed a sudden strange fascination with pedal steel. I really have no idea why. Anyhoo, I am in the market for one but I really have no clue what to buy. All this talk of C9,E9, 10string, 12string, etc has my head spinning.
I want to get something decent. Knowing me, it is something that I will tinker with for years so I don't want to buy junk. At the same time, I don't want to buy something I don't need.
I have tinkered with regular guitar for years although I would never call myself a guitarist. I have a suspicion that learning pedal steel may help my understanding of chords and theory and therefore improve my sax playing.
Thanks in advance guys. Any help is appreciated. |
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Tom Gorr
From:
Three Hills, Alberta
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Posted 31 Jul 2014 10:49 am
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Hi Peter, welcome to the forum.
I think your background is well suited to playing steel, it's more machine than anything, and it takes a lot of those forms of interests and skillsets.
Kind of interesting that when I talk about some of my better toned steel guitars, I make reference to a race car engine. THAT'S TONE...haha
LOTS of players start out on old MSA models because they were well designed professional models and mass produced. The lacquer finished models seem to be the tonal preference on balance.
Finally, you must have come across Bob Reinhardt in your line of work, i'm a big fan of his Marshall derivative amps. |
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Lane Gray
From:
Topeka, KS
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Posted 31 Jul 2014 10:50 am
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I would start with a used pro model, single 10, three or 4 pedals and 4 or 5 knees.
Most beginner instruction materials only call for 2 knees, but if you stick with it you'll want the rest soon, and if you don't stick with it, you'll get your money back.
If you want a tinker-friendly guitar, get a 72-85 MSA.
They're very well made and very easy to work on, and they made thousands of them. And there are people making aftermarket parts that are of excellent quality.
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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Lane Gray
From:
Topeka, KS
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Jack Aldrich
From:
Washington, USA
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Posted 31 Jul 2014 11:13 am
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Back in 1975, when I was just starting, I told my friend and mentor, Larry Blum (who's currently in Eugene, OR) that I'd rented a pedal steel. He told me "well, you'll forget how to walk and drool a lot". True. Having a background in sax seems to be good for steelers, BTW.
_________________
Jack Aldrich
Carter & ShoBud D10's
D8 & T8 Stringmaster
Rickenbacher B6
3 Resonator guitars
Asher Alan Akaka Special SN 6
Canopus D8 |
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Peter Harrell
From:
North Carolina, USA
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Peter Harrell
From:
North Carolina, USA
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Posted 31 Jul 2014 11:16 am
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| Jack Aldrich wrote: |
| Back in 1975, when I was just starting, I told my friend and mentor, Larry Blum (who's currently in Eugene, OR) that I'd rented a pedal steel. He told me "well, you'll forget how to walk and drool a lot". True. Having a background in sax seems to be good for steelers, BTW. |
I've wondered about that. Seems that you slide around quite a bit with both instruments. Are there any upper level slide players that double on sax? |
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Peter Harrell
From:
North Carolina, USA
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Posted 31 Jul 2014 11:19 am
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| Tom Gorr wrote: |
Finally, you must have come across Bob Reinhardt in your line of work, i'm a big fan of his Marshall derivative amps. |
I don't think I have heard of him. I specialize in drag racing engines so that narrows things down a little. |
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Lane Gray
From:
Topeka, KS
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Posted 31 Jul 2014 11:23 am
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Excellent choice!!
Fair price as long as it's in good shape.
Do you know any local steel players who might be free to check it out? If you don't, it might be difficult to make sure it's not playing gunky. With your engine background, though, it might not be too hard.
The single neck push pull is regarded as the Holy Grail of modern steel tone, and that is one.
As long as condition matches the ad, buy it this evening...
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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Peter Harrell
From:
North Carolina, USA
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Posted 31 Jul 2014 11:49 am
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| Lane Gray wrote: |
Excellent choice!!
Fair price as long as it's in good shape.
Do you know any local steel players who might be free to check it out? If you don't, it might be difficult to make sure it's not playing gunky. With your engine background, though, it might not be too hard.
The single neck push pull is regarded as the Holy Grail of modern steel tone, and that is one.
As long as condition matches the ad, buy it this evening... |
Ok. So that's a good price? |
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Jack Aldrich
From:
Washington, USA
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Posted 31 Jul 2014 11:52 am
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| Peter Harrell wrote: |
| Jack Aldrich wrote: |
| Back in 1975, when I was just starting, I told my friend and mentor, Larry Blum (who's currently in Eugene, OR) that I'd rented a pedal steel. He told me "well, you'll forget how to walk and drool a lot". True. Having a background in sax seems to be good for steelers, BTW. |
I've wondered about that. Seems that you slide around quite a bit with both instruments. Are there any upper level slide players that double on sax? |
Big Jim Murphy doubled on sax and steel (his ShoBud ProIII and his D8 Stringmaster) when he played with Asleep At The Wheel at EXP up here about 10 years ago comes to mind. I also played alto, tenor and baritone saxes back in my salad says. I also believe that Alvino Rey started on sax. Anybody else know others?
_________________
Jack Aldrich
Carter & ShoBud D10's
D8 & T8 Stringmaster
Rickenbacher B6
3 Resonator guitars
Asher Alan Akaka Special SN 6
Canopus D8 |
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Lane Gray
From:
Topeka, KS
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Posted 31 Jul 2014 12:29 pm
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First, the Emmons: that's not a screaming deal, and it's not a ripoff. BUT it's a great axe if in good shape. If you have the cash, get it.
In the late 70s/early 80s, Crash Craddock's steel player doubled on sax
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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Paul Sutherland
From:
Placerville, California
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Posted 31 Jul 2014 12:36 pm
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If that Emmons wasn't 3000 plus miles away I'd tell you not to get it, and then I'd run down and buy it.
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It don't mean a thing if it ain't got that swing. |
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Kevin Raymer
From:
Chalybeate, Kentucky, USA
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Posted 31 Jul 2014 2:13 pm
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Personally before I went $2500 for the CL Emmons, I'd go the $2900 for this one.
http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=269244
But that's just me.
And I have no affiliation with nor do I even know the seller of this guitar.
Just been watching it up for sale and lusting after it.
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Kevin Raymer
Zum / Knaggs / Breedlove
Fractal Audio |
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Kevin Raymer
From:
Chalybeate, Kentucky, USA
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Richard Sinkler
From:
aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
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Posted 31 Jul 2014 2:17 pm
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I would go for the push/pull if it didn't need work. If if does, I would check into getting a tech to adjust it up. That might be able to be done for the difference in price.
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Carter D10 8p/8k, Dekley S10 3p/4k C6 setup,Regal RD40 Dobro, NV400, NV112 . Playing for 54 years and still counting. |
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Tom Gorr
From:
Three Hills, Alberta
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Posted 31 Jul 2014 2:53 pm
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| Peter Harrell wrote: |
| Tom Gorr wrote: |
Finally, you must have come across Bob Reinhardt in your line of work, i'm a big fan of his Marshall derivative amps. |
I don't think I have heard of him. I specialize in drag racing engines so that narrows things down a little. |
I see, he's a Nascar guy.
BTW, i'd go for the guitar that calls you over when you see it in your home studio...i think that emmons you posted is pretty much where guys end their search, not where they begin, so if you have the coin, i'd check it out and make a deal happen. |
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Herb Steiner
From:
Spicewood TX 78669
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Posted 31 Jul 2014 3:41 pm
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That PP is unmolested and in original condition. No extra screw holes in the undercarriage, finish in excellent shape, looks to me very lightly used for its age. $2500 is a more than fair price, IMHO. I'd get it myself if I didn't already have 2 PP S-10s.
_________________
My rig: Infinity and Telonics.
Son, we live in a world with walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with steel guitars. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinberg? |
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Ollin Landers
From:
Willow Springs, NC
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Posted 1 Aug 2014 4:14 am
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Pete,
I've lusted after this guitar since Jim told me about it but I just don't have the cash. The owner (Jim) of the Emmons for sale in Greensboro is a friend of mine. He is a guitar player that wanted to learn steel years ago and just never did. I've sat in with his band a few times on steel.
I know personally he bought that guitar new from the factory and rarely played it. He has the original bill of receipt, registration card and all the paper work. He went to the Emmons factory a few years ago and had them look up the registration card and match them up.
It's a Day setup and he told me the 4th pedal is original from the factory. I have no idea of the copedant. He did tell me there is a little finish checking but on a guitar of this age that's probably expected.
It's been under his bed for many years. I have his direct phone number I could place a call for anyone that wants to speak with him.
The last time I talked with him I thought he sold it to a guy from Boone NC.
Pete, You can contact me off forum and I can put you in touch or help you in any way I can. I would be more than happy to help you go check out a steel at anytime.
_________________
Zum SD-12 Black, Zum SD-12 Burly Elm Several B-Bender Tele's and a lot of other gear I can't play.
I spent half my money on gambling, alcohol and wild women. The other half I wasted. W.C. Fields |
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Lane Gray
From:
Topeka, KS
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Posted 1 Aug 2014 4:26 am
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In that case, I'd buy it in a heartbeat.
It is a good price on a great guitar, and would only need a few drops of oil, if anything at all.
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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Lane Gray
From:
Topeka, KS
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Posted 1 Aug 2014 4:35 am
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The extra pedal looks like it drops 1&7. Weird. I wouldn't let that stop me: it can get reassigned later if you don't think of uses for it.
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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Chris Brooks
From:
Providence, Rhode Island
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Posted 1 Aug 2014 7:09 am
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Peter, the push-pull could be your first and last guitar . ... I mean that in a good way, as in a lifetime instrument. Lots of guys would love to have it.
And it's pretty!
Chris |
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Herb Steiner
From:
Spicewood TX 78669
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Posted 1 Aug 2014 7:11 am
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| Lane Gray wrote: |
| The extra pedal looks like it drops 1&7. Weird. I wouldn't let that stop me: it can get reassigned later if you don't think of uses for it. |
Not totally weird. Jimmy Day had that change on a Mullen he showed me.
_________________
My rig: Infinity and Telonics.
Son, we live in a world with walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with steel guitars. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinberg? |
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Storm Rosson
From:
Silver City, NM. USA
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Posted 1 Aug 2014 10:11 am
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I personally would go with a Zum Encore,new excellent in all mechanical aspects, much easier to work on and tune etc. (IMO) than a P/P affordable. Just my thoughts..  |
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Tommy Auldridge
From:
Maryland, USA
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Posted 4 Aug 2014 6:55 am Go with the Emmons
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Get the Emmons. I really would like to have that one myself. I already have 7 push pull Emmons, or I would be heading on down there to pick this one up.
Tommy....... |
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