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Topic: My 1935 National adventure |
Ralph Czitrom
From:
Ringwood, New Jersey
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Posted 22 Feb 2014 9:47 am |
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For as long as I’ve been interested in the steel guitar, I’ve been fascinated by the National/Dobro cast aluminum lap steels of the mid-1930’s (probably for the same reason that cars from that era seem to be from another planet). But while the Rickenbacher fry pans of that time are the holy grail of lap steel players (for all the reasons previously discussed in many threads here), I hadn’t heard all that much, positive or negative, about the cast aluminum National/Dobro line (made from 1935-37), other than Gino Bordin, the French steeler of the thirties, who referred to his National as “la guitare magiqueâ€.
I looked around for one in good shape, and quickly found that they are fairly rare, which often brings inflated prices for junk. After a year of searching, one day I found myself in the Vintage section of the Guitar Center website, and saw a six string 1935 National Electric steel (#N363) for sale for $350. It looked to be structurally sound, though the (dual coil) pickup was dead. Before buying it, I checked with Jason Lollar to see if he would work on the pickup, and he said that he would, if only because he’d never worked on one of them before and wanted to get the original specs.
When I received the guitar, I saw that someone had drilled a hole in it, apparently wanting to add a tone control to a guitar with just a volume pot. In addition, at one point the guitar was made into a seven stringer, but that was not a problem. For about a week after removing the pickup (which was very crude and has a big honkin’ horseshoe magnet) and sending it to Jason, I worked on the body, stripping off and replacing the old felt, using metal putty to fill the hole, deoxidizing the front aluminum and polishing it, and then repainting the gold leaf in the panels. The fretboard was cleaned with naptha, and 0000 steel wool, and then rubbed with boiled linseed oil. Talk about getting in touch with your instrument! Then the pickup arrived back from Lollar (they remagnetized the horseshoe and rewound the coils: 10,000 turns using #43 wire) and somehow I was able to reinstall it, needing to adjust the blades by hand. The first time I plugged in was magical! Of course, it’s not possible to know what this guitar sounded like in 1935, but today it has a terrific, full sound, with no hum. Good bass and a bright tone, but not too much. Adjustments to tone are made on my amp.
According to Mark Makin’s wonderful book, “Palm Trees, Senoritas and Rocket Shipsâ€, about the history and art of the National/Dobro/Supro/Valco lines, there are only 22 of the 1935 Nationals which have been identified as still in existence. This one makes it 23. For the “show†part of this show and tell, below are a few before and after photos (and check out the decal on the case featuring Country Music Hall of Famer Patsy Montana and the Prairie Ramblers…). A very fulfilling project, for sure…
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Raymond Jones
From:
British Columbia, Canada
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Posted 22 Feb 2014 11:25 am These are very nice to ply !!
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Very Nice restoration job. I know you will enjoy this a lot.They liked the design so no changes in 1939 except for the tone control and the unique height adjustment for the pickup. I did not need to have anything done to the pup or controls even after all these years. I was the first to open the back.
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Raymond Jones
From:
British Columbia, Canada
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Posted 22 Feb 2014 11:28 am Body material -
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| Just to add that the body material is a ZINC based alloy not aluminum. |
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Noah Miller
From:
Rocky Hill, CT
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Posted 22 Feb 2014 12:40 pm Re: Body material -
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| Raymond Jones wrote: |
| Just to add that the body material is a ZINC based alloy not aluminum. |
No, it's definitely aluminum. I ran my National Hawaiian under an XRF gun, and it came back as a fairly typical cast aluminum alloy (sadly, I didn't write down which). |
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Raymond Jones
From:
British Columbia, Canada
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Posted 22 Feb 2014 1:01 pm Metal test I did -
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| when I first posted about my "new" National I also said aluminum. I was questioned by a member here so I found that a test was to clean a spot on the metal and apply a drop of HCL. Aluminum remains white and zinc turns dark and blackish, which is what the National did upon testing. When I read up on the casting method it was called a "slush cast".This allows for a hollow interior to be made and also requires much less finishing needed.With the high temperature melt and pour method much machining is required. |
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Noah Miller
From:
Rocky Hill, CT
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Posted 22 Feb 2014 1:08 pm Re: Metal test I did -
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| Raymond Jones wrote: |
| Aluminum remains white and zinc turns dark and blackish |
That's not really true. What you're seeing is the oxidation of the lesser ingredients in the alloy - carbon, iron, etc. Aluminum alloys often turn dark under acid etches; it depends on the makeup of the metal. Aluminum is frequently slush cast just like zinc, and would have been much cheaper at the time. Zinc requires just as much machining after casting just as aluminum does; it's a question of the accuracy of the mold, not the alloy that's poured into it. |
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C. E. Jackson
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Posted 22 Feb 2014 1:24 pm
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Ralph, I have a 1935 7 string National with SN: N182. I purchased my National from Charlie Norris, Member, Texas Steel Guitar Hall of Fame. He had purchased the guitar new, but sold it before he went into the service as a teenager. Many years later, he repurchased it, and continued to own it until I purchased it from him in 2004. Charlie said that he picked cotton for $.03/lb. (2,265 lbs.) to pay the $69.95 new price. He also said that he took weekly lessons from the traveling Hawaiians for $1.00/wk., and the weekly fee was paid with 3 dozen eggs.
The guitar is in excellent all original condition, and the sound is great.
I tune to A6: E C# A F# E C# A (H-L)
I believe that you will enjoy playing your National. Keep in touch and let me know.
C. E. Jackson
_________________
My Vintage Steel Guitars
My YouTube Steel Guitar Playlists
My YouTube Steel Guitar Songs
A6 tuning for steels
Last edited by C. E. Jackson on 22 Feb 2014 1:32 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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James Hartman
From:
Pennsylvania, USA
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Posted 22 Feb 2014 1:31 pm
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| Wow. That is cool! |
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Tom Pettingill
From:
California, USA (deceased)
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Paul Honeycutt
From:
Colorado, USA
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Posted 22 Feb 2014 3:37 pm
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| I don't think I've ever seen one of those before. Congrats on the restoration and thanks for the pictures. |
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Doug Beaumier
From:
Northampton, MA
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C. E. Jackson
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Posted 22 Feb 2014 4:35 pm
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Ralph, my sincere apologies for not expressing how excellent a job you did in restoration of your National. Frankly, I was so shocked to learn that only 22 1935 Nationals are thought to still be in existence, my first thought was to simply let you know that I, like you, own one of the 22.
Your restoration is certainly one of the best I have ever seen, and I know that you will highly prize this instrument. After you have played it for a while, please let me know how much you enjoy playing it.
C. E. Jackson
_________________
My Vintage Steel Guitars
My YouTube Steel Guitar Playlists
My YouTube Steel Guitar Songs
A6 tuning for steels |
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Michael Greer
From:
Ontario, Canada
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Posted 23 Feb 2014 4:21 am
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Ralph
I share your admiration for the styling of these 1935-1937 cast Nationals
Your restoration looks fantastic......I will bet its good for another 80 years. |
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Ralph Czitrom
From:
Ringwood, New Jersey
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Posted 23 Feb 2014 5:35 am
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| Thanks guys. So I've been playing the guitar for a few days and enjoying it a great deal. Nice tone, great vibe. But there's one thing about it that I don't understand, and that is, what's up with the fret markers? I'm used to getting help from them when I'm looking for harmonic positions. On this guitar, they don't match: fret 3 has one dot, but fret 15 has two, fret 5 has two dots and fret 17 has one, etc. I see that on Raymond's guitar, the markers correspond (frets 3 and 15 have one dot, 5 and 17 have two, etc.) Can't tell about C.E.'s National. It's kind of amusing and doesn't detract from the guitar, but I'd love to understand the thinking (or lack of it) which went into the positioning. But, 80 years later, that's a question for which there is likely no answer. By the way, I've looked at some pictures of other short scale 1935 Nationals, and they had the same mismatched fret markings. |
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C. E. Jackson
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Posted 23 Feb 2014 6:40 am
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Ralph, fret dot markings on my 1935 National are as shown below. I, like you, find them different from most guitars, but don't know why. Maybe some of our members can enlighten us.
Fret
1....2 dots
3....1 dot
5....2 dots
7....1 dot
9....1 dot
12...2 dots
15...2 dots
17...1 dot
19...2 dots
C. E.
_________________
My Vintage Steel Guitars
My YouTube Steel Guitar Playlists
My YouTube Steel Guitar Songs
A6 tuning for steels |
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Mark MacKenzie
From:
Franklin, Tennessee, USA
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Posted 16 Mar 2014 5:10 pm
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| Glad to see this post. I have this guitar but someone removed the coil (s). I had no idea there was more than one coil. Can anybody please tell me how they are wound, how they are placed, what the shape of the blades are? Any help most appreciated. I do know my horseshoe magnet is magnetized with one leg north and the other leg south so I am way confused. Many thanks! |
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Michael Greer
From:
Ontario, Canada
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Posted 17 Mar 2014 4:21 pm
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Mark
sent you an email |
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Mark MacKenzie
From:
Franklin, Tennessee, USA
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Posted 17 Mar 2014 5:04 pm
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Thanks to all. Very helpful people these steel guitar guys.
Here's the story on mine. I bought it a few years back thinking I could fix it. It didn't have a coil. I wound one but didn't sound so great.
Anyway, Oct. 4th last year the house was broken into and I lost 10 guitars including a Ricky Bakelite, Supro, Electar, and this National Electric Hawaiian. Williamson County Sherriff's Dep't was able to find the Supro and the Electar but no others.
Last Saturday night I was playing at a gig and a guy walked up and asked how I tuned my Supro cause he just bought a new to him all metal guitar. We talked and sure enough it was mine. We met later in the week and I paid him what he was out and got mine back still without a coil.
Now I'm all excited and want to fix it.
Many thanks,
Mark |
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Barry Fagan
From:
Columbus, Ohio, USA
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Posted 29 Aug 2014 4:40 pm
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I'm new to this site, but this post caught my eye as I was surfing the Internet.
I purchased a dilapidated 1935 National lap steel guitar at a flea market in Fayette County, Ohio around 1980, & just hung it on the wall. (I play a little guitar & banjo but haven’t yet learned lap steel.) The Internet wasn’t around in 1980 so the only references to the instrument that I found back then were brief paragraphs in books on the history of the electric guitar. This past winter was so inhospitable in Ohio that I went back to some old projects that I had mothballed & one of them was to research the National. I was delighted to come across a thread on them on your site. I now know that it has been refinished (poorly) and that it is fairy complete, but conversely its still non-functional & its missing the back plate & the back felt. I do have the pickup components, magnet & tuning keys.
I’m hoping to learn enough to get it up & running, & I’m happy to post a few pictures. The serial number is N162.
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