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Author Topic:  Duesenberg multibender stuff
Steve Lipsey


From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
Post Posted 30 Jul 2013 9:45 am     Reply with quote

Anybody have a clue what the differences really are, other than the pickups? They say it is an updated multibender unit also...but I don't see it....and the Pomona is still offered, at nearly the same price...

http://www.duesenbergusa.com/guitars/pomona6/index.html
http://www.duesenbergusa.com/products/ftail/index.html

I've recently become enamored with the idea of these crazy things...my Road-o-phonic lap steel sized dobro is a lot of fun (and sounds great amplified at gigs), and a "pedal steel" in a lap steel form factor would be a great travel/jam/low-key gig toy (toy?).

Any other comments on the multibender would be welcome...I've read all the old posts, but am still curious to hear more....multibender on a strat? on a Rondo? etc.
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Last edited by Steve Lipsey on 1 Aug 2013 9:41 am; edited 2 times in total
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Alan Brookes


From:
Brummy living in the San Francisco Bay Area
Post Posted 30 Jul 2013 10:08 am     Reply with quote

I shall be interested to hear from someone who owns either of these models.

If you use the Search function there are many of us who have attached a Multibender to a lap steel over the years, but I don't know anyone who owns a Pomona.

I'm beginning to think that this is only a half-way stage. I've played a lap steel with a Multibender for several years now. It has severe limitations in that you can only attach one string to each lever, and they have to be attached in order. For instance, you couldn't use the far lever on the second string and the next lever on the first.

The sliding nut/capo is just a gimmick. You can do the same thing by slipping the right sized tone bar under the strings.

A much better solution would be an entire pedal steel mechanism, but worked from palm levers.
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Steve Lipsey


From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
Post Posted 30 Jul 2013 10:14 am     Reply with quote

Alan-
I'm still curious to hear more multibender comments of any sort....fyi, these are from the guy I bought the Roadie from, who then bought a Pomona:

"On the Duesey. It is probably the best sounding lap steel I have owned and
the mechanics are terrific (German engineering). The main challenge to
playing it is getting a palm roll down like the steel guitar foot roll on
the AB pedals. It's all physical but practice helps all. I had string
breakage in the beginning but Forum members came to the rescue and no
problem since. I have to say that when we play a small room, coffee house
style or a house party, it sure is nice to just walk in with my Cube 80XL
and that little Duesey."

"It is really a "pocket pedal steel". It is long scale which is great for sustain and the pickups are super hot! My only issue with it is practicing to get the physical part down, which is coming along. Keep in mind you are using your palm on the benders and picking at the same time. I'm finding it just takes practice. It stays in tune really well (tunes at the keys and at the bridge). The B to C# and G# to A change make for a perfect pedal steel sound and without the benders it's a mean blues lap steel. For a pedal steel gig you'd still want your Williams, but for small, tight stages or jams or R&R and R&B it's perfect. I think the biggest negative is the price."
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Tom Pettingill


From:
California, USA
Post Posted 30 Jul 2013 10:23 am     Reply with quote

I've done a few builds with the Dusenberg multibender and they can be a lot of fun.
Although it can be set to either raise or lower a string, in practical use it raises better than lowers. Thats not to say it can not lower well, just that its a bit more fiddly to get dialed in a good balance between string tension and the bridges return spring so that the string retains proper tuning on the return.
If your looking to roll your own, Rockinger out of Germany is where I've been getting mine http://www.rockinger.com/index.php?cat=WG081&lang=ENG&product=2405C
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Peter den Hartogh


From:
Cape Town, South Africa
Post Posted 30 Jul 2013 12:00 pm     Reply with quote

Here is a Pomona owner:
http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=249621
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Nate Hofer


From:
Overland Park, Kansas
Post Posted 31 Jul 2013 4:24 am     Reply with quote

Six strings, two benders. How do you guys tune these?
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Brad Bechtel


From:
San Francisco, CA
Post Posted 31 Jul 2013 10:08 am     Reply with quote

If you guys read the description on the Duesenberg website, you'd have some of your answers.

Quote:
When the Pomona lapsteel was introduced in 2008, it was a sensation! For the very first time there was a lapsteel that had the best elements of a lap- and pedalsteel all rolled into one.

We are proud to introduce our new Duesenberg "Fairytale" lapsteel with gold-burst finish and many improved details, like the newest generation of the Duesenberg Multibender, the improved integrated capodaster, a new pickup combination with the new PH-90 anti-hum single coil and our Grand Vintage Humbucker.

Standard factory-set tuning is D A D F# A D.


So it looks like an improved Multibender and new finish (besides the upgraded pickups). Since it was just introduced, I doubt anyone here has had a chance to play one yet.

I know that Randy Kohrs is an endorser and satisfied user of the Duesenberg Pomona. I saw him performing at the Station Inn in Nashville last year with it, and he sounded great.
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Mark Eaton


From:
Sonoma County in The Great State Of Northern California
Post Posted 31 Jul 2013 11:33 am     Reply with quote

Alan Brookes wrote:


The sliding nut/capo is just a gimmick. You can do the same thing by slipping the right sized tone bar under the strings.



What's nice about this is that it is permanently mounted on the guitar, sort of like certain capos for standard acoustic guitars that can be slid down to rest behind the nut when not in use.

This thing on the Duesenberg is fairly similar in design to any number of "floating" dobro capos on the market that clamp to the strings, but even cooler is that it travels up and down the neck on a rail. I think it's pretty slick - makes for more positive contact than the floating dobro capos, which do a reasonably good job.

It had never occurred to me that these things were "gimmicks," and I'm sure that Paul Beard, Elmer Bradley, Tim Scheerhorn, and others whom have designed and built dobro capos of this ilk, probably don't think of them as being gimmicks either...
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Nate Hofer


From:
Overland Park, Kansas
Post Posted 31 Jul 2013 12:29 pm     Reply with quote

Brad Bechtel wrote:
If you guys read the description on the Duesenberg website, you'd have some of your answers.

Quote:
When the Pomona lapsteel was introduced in 2008, it was a sensation! For the very first time there was a lapsteel that had the best elements of a lap- and pedalsteel all rolled into one.

We are proud to introduce our new Duesenberg "Fairytale" lapsteel with gold-burst finish and many improved details, like the newest generation of the Duesenberg Multibender, the improved integrated capodaster, a new pickup combination with the new PH-90 anti-hum single coil and our Grand Vintage Humbucker.

Standard factory-set tuning is D A D F# A D.


Brad, I read that and figured it was the factory recommendation and wondered too if there were other options. So with that tuning am I right in assuming the benders pull the F# up to G and the A to B? Thus making a G9 chord? (DADGBD)
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Kurt Kowalski


From:
Kendall, NY USA
Post Posted 31 Jul 2013 2:23 pm     Reply with quote

I tune mine to
E
Low to high
E, B, E, G#, B, E

2 levers

G# raise to A

B raise to C#

It works great for a and b pedal pedal steel licks

The same as Martin Hutch uses on his Duesys

Do a youtube search for Martin hutch and multibender... You will be pleased

Thanks guys
Hope I helped

Kurt
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Steve Lipsey


From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
Post Posted 1 Aug 2013 9:26 am     Reply with quote

Kurt - you ever sell your strat with bender? People are asking in the "For Sale" section.....

Brad- Yeah, thanks, I had seen that by didn't realize that it was completely brand new and unlikely to have been played by anyone yet....
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Last edited by Steve Lipsey on 1 Aug 2013 9:43 am; edited 1 time in total
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Steve Lipsey


From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
Post Posted 1 Aug 2013 9:41 am     Tuning and bender options Reply with quote

Tuning:
I was thinking B D E G# B E (lo to hi) would be closest to the most common pedal steel grips....

How many benders, and doing what?
-I was thinking strings 2 & 3 for the A and B pedal steel pedals, that seems to be standard
-And then string 1 E-F# for the C pedal (with string 2+3 benders). I know some do E-F - is that to get a diminished chord? And/or a VI chord, with string 2 lever? I'd rather have the IIm, which is a VIm in pedals down position....I play alt-country and need that...
-And also string 4 E-D# for the E lower pedal steel lever, to get IIIm and V7 (with string 2 lever)
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Alan Brookes


From:
Brummy living in the San Francisco Bay Area
Post Posted 2 Aug 2013 9:34 am     Reply with quote

You can only pull one string with each lever on the Multibender. I have four levers on mine and find that I mostly use just two of them. Also, if you try to lower one of the bass strings the springs aren't strong enough to bring the string back to pitch. Sad

This is why you can't use pedal steel regular A and B pedal tunings without using multiple levers. It's difficult to work with more than two levers, and even with three it's difficult to push down levers one and three, for instance, without moving lever 2. There is a tendency to lean your palm on the levers, which puts your instrument out of tune if you don't work hard at it.
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Steve Lipsey


From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
Post Posted 2 Aug 2013 10:36 am     Reply with quote

Ah...Alan....right....I keep forgetting that I only have two hands, can't pick and press separated levers at the same time...have to rethink this copedent....

EDIT: None of those pulls in my copedent above require hitting non-adjacent levers....so I think it may work....
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Alan Brookes


From:
Brummy living in the San Francisco Bay Area
Post Posted 3 Aug 2013 9:11 am     Reply with quote

That's what I originally thought, Steve. Actually, picking and pushing the levers simultaneously with the palm of the right hand is not that difficult, but picking and selecting particular levers is. One tends to just depress 1 and 2 together (in my case 2 and 3) to get the subdominant and not get involved in the complex stuff you would play on pedal steel.

The use of the mobile capo depends on your style, and is only useful if you use a lot of open strings, as in bottleneck playing. I rarely play open strings, so the capo does nothing for me.
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Steve Lipsey


From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
Post Posted 3 Aug 2013 1:15 pm     Reply with quote

duplicate post
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Last edited by Steve Lipsey on 29 Jan 2014 11:04 am; edited 1 time in total
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Steve Lipsey


From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
Post Posted 3 Aug 2013 1:16 pm     Reply with quote

Alan - thanks for those insights, nothing like hearing it from a guy who actually has done it....

So sounds like the extra levers would be fine for simple chordal backup, but not a lot of complicated single-note picking...got it, I think?!

I do notice that you left the levers on your guitar (unless it has changed from the pictures you have posted in the past), so I guess you do use them occasionally.....
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Alan Brookes


From:
Brummy living in the San Francisco Bay Area
Post Posted 3 Aug 2013 3:29 pm     Reply with quote

Steve: if you haven't already done so, check out the following threads, each of which discusses the Multibender to some extent or other:-
http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=160265&highlight=duesenberg+multibender
http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=240114&highlight=duesenberg+multibender
http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=160903&highlight=duesenberg+multibender
http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=229742&highlight=duesenberg+multibender
http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=182025&highlight=duesenberg+multibender
http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=194152&highlight=duesenberg+multibender
http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=163132&highlight=duesenberg+multibender
http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=116404&highlight=duesenberg+multibender
http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=110586&highlight=duesenberg+multibender
http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=106092&highlight=duesenberg+multibender
http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=154767&highlight=duesenberg+multibender
http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=166756&highlight=duesenberg+multibender
http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=231115&highlight=duesenberg+multibender
http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=218919&highlight=duesenberg+multibender

Yes, my Miltibender is still on my Rondo at the moment, but I'm thinking of moving it to a resonator guitar, or a resonator console steel which I haven't designed yet.

I have to say that it takes second place to my pedal and non-pedal console steels, but it's useful to just throw in your trunk and take to a gig, without having to worry about spending half the night setting up your pedal steel.

I'm still seriously thinking of how an entire pedal steel mechanism could be incorporated into a console steel with a resonator, worked from palm pedals. As you might know, I've built a lot of experimental instruments, both electric and acoustic, over the years, some of which have been successful and others not so. Very Happy
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Steve Lipsey


From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
Post Posted 3 Aug 2013 10:37 pm     Reply with quote

Alan-
they offer a multibender specifically for resonator, configured to fit right on....might be an easier add-on than trying to make your current one fit....given the different construction of an acoustic instrument...
You probably know about it:
http://www.thomann.de/gb/duesenberg_dobrola_multibender.htm
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Steve Lipsey


From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
Post Posted 4 Aug 2013 8:36 am     Reply with quote

Thanks to all of you for the info and pointers to other threads...

Looks like I will shortly be the new owner of a Gretsch 5700 with multibender, thanks to a Forum member....

It has exactly the copedent I want (even better than the one I came up with), along with added roller nut, locking tuners, custom made string 4 palm lever handle, and custom built case...

the tuning is (lo-to-hi) B, E. F#, G#, B, E with the low E lowering to Eb, G# raising to A and high B raising to C#.

Putting in the F# instead of the D eliminates the need for an E-F# lever in my copedent, at the sacrifice of the dominant 7th, but I can now get the V7 with the F# and G#-A lever for a B7...or use a standard lap steel 2-note 7th chord, e.g., C#7 at open string position.

Now I just need to figure out where to get sets of open-E strings for a short-scale guitar...



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Alan Brookes


From:
Brummy living in the San Francisco Bay Area
Post Posted 4 Aug 2013 9:41 am     Reply with quote

Steve Lipsey wrote:
...they offer a Multibender specifically for resonator, configured to fit right on....you probably know about it:

No, I hadn't seen it. It must have been introduced recently. Thanks for pointing it out. Very Happy
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Peter Funk


From:
Germany
Post Posted 5 Aug 2013 5:54 am     Reply with quote

Steve Lipsey wrote:

Looks like I will shortly be the new owner of a Gretsch 5700 with multibender, thanks to a Forum member....


Wow! I got EXACTLY the same guitar equipped with a multibender (two levers).

Look here: "Stand By Your Man"

I don't think it really substitutes a PSG but it's fun to play Very Happy
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Martin Huch


From:
Hannover, Germany
Post Posted 22 Dec 2013 12:06 pm     Reply with quote

Here`s a little track played with the new Duesenberg Fairytale (no levers used)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yBviEz13q6M&feature=youtu.be
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Alan Brookes


From:
Brummy living in the San Francisco Bay Area
Post Posted 22 Dec 2013 5:14 pm     Reply with quote

Thanks for bringing that to our attention, Martin. As you say, he doesn't use the palm levers so the piece he plays could have been played on any lap steel, but the video does let us have a good look at the Duesenberg Fairytale in action and how the capo is arranged. I may well build a movable capo into the next console steel that I build, although I myself don't play that many open strings, so I wouldn't get as much use from the capo as some other people. To me, the main problem with a capo is that, if you set the capo to be the tonic in the key that you're playing in, it prevents you from sliding back three frets from the tonic, which is important in some of the runs I play, especially in the blues.
I downloaded the video onto my computer so that I can have it for reference.
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