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Topic: Switching to different tunings on-the-fly. |
Joseph Salesi
From:
Massachusetts, USA
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Posted 1 Nov 2009 9:38 am |
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Hello,
I was wondering how some of you guys change tunings when playing a series of songs. What if you have only one guitar but need to change tunings. Do you train yourself to tune fast? Is there some kind of trick to this that makes it easier? |
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Tom Pettingill
From:
California, USA (deceased)
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Joseph Salesi
From:
Massachusetts, USA
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Posted 1 Nov 2009 10:22 am
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| Tom Pettingill wrote: |
| The most common solution is a multi neck steel or a second guitar. |
I was reading about Jerry Byrd and that guy mostly changed tunings between songs. Quite impressive. I wonder how fast he could do it.  |
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Rick Schmidt
From:
Prescott AZ, USA
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Posted 1 Nov 2009 10:31 am
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http://store.hipshotproducts.com/cart.php?m=product_detail&p=34
Purists don't particularly like these, but I do. I have the dobro version on my el cheapo Johnson reso, and although not perfect, it does allow me to change tunings way faster than the manual method. I just have to briefly fine tune at the keyhead after I make the major changes with the levers. I'd love to have a specially made lap steel with one of these systems on it! |
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Joseph Salesi
From:
Massachusetts, USA
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Posted 1 Nov 2009 10:47 am
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| Rick Schmidt wrote: |
http://store.hipshotproducts.com/cart.php?m=product_detail&p=34
Purists don't particularly like these, but I do. I have the dobro version on my el cheapo Johnson reso, and although not perfect, it does allow me to change tunings way faster than the manual method. I just have to briefly fine tune at the keyhead after I make the major changes with the levers. I'd love to have a specially made lap steel with one of these systems on it! |
Hmm, I wonder how many players use these. |
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Doug Beaumier
From:
Northampton, MA
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Posted 1 Nov 2009 10:50 am
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Players like Herb Remington and Jerry Byrd would often retune between songs by ear.
If I were changing tunings on stage I would use one of those little clip-on vibration tuners (chromatic). The audience hears nothing, because you shut down your guitar's volume, and the tuner picks up the vibrations from the wood body of your instrument. No one hears a thing because there is no sound. You can tune during a song, between songs, etc. I've been using one of these tuners for over a year for my guitar gigs and it works excellent. I clip it on the headstock of my telecaster and leave it there for the entire gig. The best $25 I ever spent! Attaching it to a steel guitar might be a problem, but it will work if attached to any part of the steel guitar, a switch tip, a tuner button, a control knob, etc. No cord needed, and no sound needed.
_________________
My Site / My YouTube Channel
25 Songs C6 Lap Steel / 25 MORE Songs C6 Lap Steel / 16 Songs, C6, A6, B11 / 60 Popular Melodies E9 Pedal Steel
Last edited by Doug Beaumier on 1 Nov 2009 11:00 am; edited 4 times in total |
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Rick Schmidt
From:
Prescott AZ, USA
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Posted 1 Nov 2009 10:55 am
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| I love that tuner also! It's always on my reso! |
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Joseph Salesi
From:
Massachusetts, USA
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Posted 1 Nov 2009 12:00 pm
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| Now that seems like a pretty cool solution. |
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Ray Montee
From:
Portland, Oregon (deceased)
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Posted 1 Nov 2009 1:06 pm Regarding tunings...................
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JERRY BYRD, I do beleieve, did NOT make it a habit of changing tunings back and forth but rather........
as needed, when needed........
for a particular song at that moment.
Once you know and understand exactly what a tuning is about.....you'll be better able to evaluate what it is you think you're seeking/hearing.
The song determines what tuning the artist might select. Playability......easier to play.....or a certain sound. |
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Doug Beaumier
From:
Northampton, MA
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Posted 1 Nov 2009 2:26 pm
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This clip-on works on vibration, not sound. Here is one way to attach it to a Stringmaster or any other steel guitar (yes, I know, there are only 6 strings on the guitar now.)  Just clip the tuner to the cord coming off the output jack. It's chromatic so it tunes all notes.
This is a good "on stage" solution for tuning or retuning. During a song or between songs turn off your volume so no one hears the guitar, not even you... and the tuner works perfectly. It picks up the vibrations. When you are done tuning shut off the Power on the tuner and leave it clipped to the guitar. When you need it again just click the power on. I've been using this on regular guitar for about a year, clipped to the headstock of my telecaster for the entire gig and it works great.
For the home player this might not make as much sense, but for the bandstand it's very handy. At home I just lay a little KORG chromatic tuner on top of the guitar and turn on the power whenever it's needed (no cord, just the mic in the tuner). I never play with a tuner "in line" because I think that changes the tone somewhat.
_________________
My Site / My YouTube Channel
25 Songs C6 Lap Steel / 25 MORE Songs C6 Lap Steel / 16 Songs, C6, A6, B11 / 60 Popular Melodies E9 Pedal Steel |
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Ron Victoria
From:
New Jersey, USA
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Posted 1 Nov 2009 3:09 pm
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Thanks Doug. That's perfect for when I play out. Now I won't have to say, give me an E. I saw the tuner on Ebay for $23 shipped. I would rather go to Sam Ash and pay a little more.
ron |
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Josh Cho
From:
New York, NY (orig. Honolulu, HI)
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Posted 1 Nov 2009 3:50 pm great idea
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Last winter I went to a slack key guitar seminar and all the guys had these clip on tuners--I've been meaning ever since to get one for the steels!
Thanks for the reminder, Doug. Great idea 
Best wishes,
Josh
_________________
Lap-n-Console Steel Guitar Lessons |
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David Soreff
From:
North Las Vegas, NV
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Posted 1 Nov 2009 4:01 pm
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Doug,
You hit the nail with this one. I have been using these for quite some time, and actually have about three of them. One on my guitar, one on my ukulele and one on my steel. Best money I ever spent. |
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Ray Montee
From:
Portland, Oregon (deceased)
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Posted 1 Nov 2009 4:28 pm Question...........please
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HOW do we KNOW............that six different identical units, purchased at different stores, on different occasions, for different prices, .....
will all have an identical PITCH?
I know that with regular electronic tuners.....
many simply ARE NOT calibrated to where they are all on identical pitch.
Say what? |
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Josh Cho
From:
New York, NY (orig. Honolulu, HI)
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Rick Schmidt
From:
Prescott AZ, USA
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Posted 1 Nov 2009 8:26 pm
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Ray...all tuners, pitch pipes, tuning forks, pianos, concert masters etc. are subject to possible variations in the relative world of pitch. You kinda have to trust when somebody tells you it's 440, it's more than likely gonna be 440. If the band still sounds out of tune, then tune up the best you can. Just like we've always done. That little tuner has different calibration setting just like they all do. Right or wrong we all are gonna end up using our subjective ears anyway if it doesn't sound right.
Does anybody know if there's anything like an atomic clock-like standard in the world of absolute pitch? |
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Roman Sonnleitner
From:
Vienna, Austria
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Posted 2 Nov 2009 2:12 am
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| Doug Beaumier wrote: |
I never play with a tuner "in line" because I think that changes the tone somewhat.
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This may have been true when the Boss TU2 was the only choice around - but these days there are a few "true bypass" tuners that don't have any effect on the tone at all (because the input is hardwired to the output when in bypass mode - no electronic devices in the signal chain then!) - the Korg Pitchblack and the Sonic Research Turbo Tuner are two such models.
Those clip-ons are a good solution too, but I play a number of instruments (Telecaster, baritone guitar, C6 lap steel, E6 lap steel with bender unit...), and if I had to get a tuner for each of them, that would get pricey quick - but since all of those are played through the same pedalboard & amp, I simply stick a Pitchblack on that board (BTW, the Pitchblack also mutes the signal when tuning!) |
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Garry Vanderlinde
From:
CA
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Posted 2 Nov 2009 5:34 am
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I like these Timara string drops. Three or four tunings at hand. They get you close very fast.
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Morgan Scoggins
From:
Georgia, USA
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Posted 2 Nov 2009 8:20 am
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I usually start out with a tuning like Emaj for my first two or three songs. Then I make a qwick change to C#mi7 buy raising the B string to C#. I progress on to A6 or B11, then C6 and each change requires only a half tone or whole tone adjustment of a string or two or three.The whole process takes only a few seconds and I do it by ear, i.e. when I raise the second string to C#, I always check it at the third fret to see if it is in unison with the first string E.
_________________
"Shoot low boys, the're ridin' Shetlands" |
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Danny James
From:
Summerfield Florida USA
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Posted 2 Nov 2009 11:38 am
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I designed and built my own tuning changer in my lapsteel guitar that I also built.
The changer is completely tuneable to different copedants within the limits of string stretch. It has 4 tunings available with the flip of a single lever. I have had it for about 3 years now and it is trouble free and stays in tune well. I made it to accept 8 strings but it is set up for 6 strings at this time.
My tunings are low bass Amaj, A6th, C6th, & E.
Works for me 
I find that certain songs for me are easier played and sound better with just certain tunings. Example-- For "Steel uitar Rag" I like the E tuning. For "Remington Ride" I like the C6th best. |
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Twayn Williams
From:
Portland, OR
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Posted 2 Nov 2009 12:58 pm
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| Doug Beaumier wrote: |
| Players like Herb Remington and Jerry Byrd would often retune between songs by ear. |
Frankly, I find it kinda weird anyone would be impressed by the ability to tune a guitar by ear instead of using a tuner (general comment, not directed specifically at you Doug!) If the difference in tunings are only a matter of a string or two, as long as you can hear yourself it should be no big deal (PSG excluded from this!)
That being said, I hate changing tunings and don't do it. I have enough problems with the 2 steel tunings I use -- E9 on PSG, B6 for lap. I don't need to go around throwing monkey wrenches into the works!
_________________
Primitive Utility Steel |
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Doug Beaumier
From:
Northampton, MA
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Posted 2 Nov 2009 1:21 pm
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| Twayn Williams wrote: |
| Doug Beaumier wrote: |
| Players like Herb Remington and Jerry Byrd would often retune between songs by ear. |
Frankly, I find it kinda weird anyone would be impressed by the ability to tune a guitar by ear instead of using a tuner (general comment, not directed specifically at you Doug!) |
Impressed by the ability to tune a guitar by ear? Are you joking? Any player who Can't tune his guitar by ear should probably think about taking up another instrument.
I did not post that because I'm impressed by the ability to "tune by ear"... I've been tuning guitars by ear since I was 9 years old. I simply posted that in response to the original question about retuning on stage. It's very easy to do if you have a good ear as most working musicians do. However it's much easier, quiter, and accurate with a clip-on tuner. The audience does not want to see and hear a player retuning on stage.
_________________
My Site / My YouTube Channel
25 Songs C6 Lap Steel / 25 MORE Songs C6 Lap Steel / 16 Songs, C6, A6, B11 / 60 Popular Melodies E9 Pedal Steel |
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Twayn Williams
From:
Portland, OR
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Posted 2 Nov 2009 1:38 pm
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| Doug Beaumier wrote: |
| I did not post that because I'm impressed by the ability to "tune by ear"... I've been tuning guitars by ear since I was 9 years old. I simply posted that in response to the original question about retuning on stage. It's very easy to do if you have a good ear as most working musicians do. However it's much easier, quiter, and accurate with a clip-on tuner. The audience does not want to see and hear a player retuning on stage. |
That's why I said the comment wasn't directed at you specifically  I've read many, many comments (from some very, very advanced players) who seem to think that the ability to retune from C6 to A6 without a tuner is some sort of super-player technique. I imagine you and I know better
Also, I really don't think most audiences care if you tune out loud on stage as long as you're relatively quick about it. I actually only use a tuning fork to tune (again, not the PSG!) I've know very advanced players who won't tune without a tuner and the end result is never quite right. It has everything to do with the subtle adjustments that are made when ear tuning, i.e. "sweetened tuning".
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Primitive Utility Steel |
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Doug Beaumier
From:
Northampton, MA
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