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Topic: Willie Nelson - Why no Steel Player in band? |
James Stewart Jr
From:
Vero Beach Florida
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Posted 20 Apr 2024 9:51 am |
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If he had a steel then Trigger(His Guitar) would not be front and center.
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1975 Sho~Bud Pro III Custom (8-7)
1981 Peavey Session 500 |
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Herb Steiner
From:
Spicewood TX 78669
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Posted 20 Apr 2024 1:41 pm
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Since I remember when Mickey Raphael joined Willie's family, (I took Mickey's spot as lead instrumentalist in BW Stevenson's band in 1973) I also remember some of the circumstances around Willie's choice of adding harmonica to his sound. This is the abbreviated version, I guess.
Willie saw that certain singers had an instrumentalist that signified and was identifiable with their (the singer's) particular sound; Ernest had Billy Byrd's single note guitar style, Carl Smith had Johnny Seibert's non-pedal style, Ray Price had Day/Emmons prominent in his sound.
Johnny Bush told me how Willie wanted an instrumental sound, a lead player that he "could have a conversation with," like Ray Price had with Day and Emmons. Mickey is a nice guy and a somewhat distinctive harp player (thanks to being with Willie 51 years now  ) so Willie chose him and the sound worked. Mickey had the support of Coach Darrell Royal, who was a god to everyone in TX, to add to Willie's decision.
I was around at that time, and that's my recollection of how Mickey got the gig, and few players have been with a performer for over a half-century that I can recall. Of course, Mickey was 21 years old when he started with Will so that might have something to do with it. 
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My rig: Infinity and Telonics.
Son, we live in a world with walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with steel guitars. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinberg? |
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Peter Dollard
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Posted 21 Apr 2024 8:39 pm Trigger
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| To me the amplified sound of an nylon string guitar is the most influential part of Willies sound. To me it sounds incredibly dry but like a singers signature it is instantly recognizable.... To me that is the most important instrument in his band no offence to Mickey who plays great... |
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Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 22 Apr 2024 11:14 am
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| James Stewart Jr wrote: |
| If he had a steel then Trigger(His Guitar) would not be front and center. |
Well sorry, but I don't buy that. Hank Thompson always had a steel player, but him and his guitar were always front and center. Same thing with other singer/instrumentalists like Bob Wills, Spade Cooley, Hank Snow, Merle Travis, and even some more modern artists like Ricky Skaggs, Brad Paisley, and Steve Wariner. Don't get me wrong, I've seen Willie (without a steel) and he puts on a great show. Still, I don't think having a steel guitar on the stage would have detracted from him and his guitar, and it would certainly have helped increase his appeal...with me, anyway.  |
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Clyde Mattocks
From:
Kinston, North Carolina, USA
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Posted 23 Apr 2024 10:35 am
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I think Nashville broke Willie from the slick, overproduced sound. When he cut the Red Headed Stranger album, it was so stripped down that the suits thought Blue Eyes Crying in the Rain was a demo. He found his musical calling in that sound and never looked back. I think he likes steel guitar, but feels it takes up too much sonic space for the sound that is his trademark. No different than Johnny Cash.
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LeGrande II, Nash. 112, Harlow Dobro |
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Dave Mudgett
From:
Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee
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Posted 23 Apr 2024 12:30 pm
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| Clyde Mattocks wrote: |
| I think Nashville broke Willie from the slick, overproduced sound. When he cut the Red Headed Stranger album, it was so stripped down that the suits thought Blue Eyes Crying in the Rain was a demo. He found his musical calling in that sound and never looked back. I think he likes steel guitar, but feels it takes up too much sonic space for the sound that is his trademark. No different than Johnny Cash. |
I think this hits the nail on the head. Willie does have a trademark sound, and it centers on his songs, voice, guitar, and sparsity. And agreed, same with Johnny Cash; Merle Haggard had plenty of pretty sparse stuff without steel; guys like Marty Robbins, Roy Orbison, and so on. Guys like this had terrific, unique voices. Sonic space is the right phrase, I think. I think steel (to my tastes) really wants that for maximum impact, and I don't think it's reasonable to expect everyone to always want to share that. Some singers don't want to share that at all. That's part of what I was trying to say earlier, in different words. |
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Doug Beaumier
From:
Northampton, MA
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Posted 23 Apr 2024 3:13 pm
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| Dave Mudgett wrote: |
| Clyde Mattocks wrote: |
| I think Nashville broke Willie from the slick, overproduced sound. When he cut the Red Headed Stranger album, it was so stripped down that the suits thought Blue Eyes Crying in the Rain was a demo. He found his musical calling in that sound and never looked back. I think he likes steel guitar, but feels it takes up too much sonic space for the sound that is his trademark. No different than Johnny Cash. |
I think this hits the nail on the head. |
I agree!
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My Site / My YouTube Channel
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John Larson
From:
Pennsyltucky, USA
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Posted 23 Apr 2024 3:31 pm
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| Dave Mudgett wrote: |
| Clyde Mattocks wrote: |
| I think Nashville broke Willie from the slick, overproduced sound. When he cut the Red Headed Stranger album, it was so stripped down that the suits thought Blue Eyes Crying in the Rain was a demo. He found his musical calling in that sound and never looked back. I think he likes steel guitar, but feels it takes up too much sonic space for the sound that is his trademark. No different than Johnny Cash. |
I think this hits the nail on the head. Willie does have a trademark sound, and it centers on his songs, voice, guitar, and sparsity. And agreed, same with Johnny Cash; Merle Haggard had plenty of pretty sparse stuff without steel; guys like Marty Robbins, Roy Orbison, and so on. Guys like this had terrific, unique voices. Sonic space is the right phrase, I think. I think steel (to my tastes) really wants that for maximum impact, and I don't think it's reasonable to expect everyone to always want to share that. Some singers don't want to share that at all. That's part of what I was trying to say earlier, in different words. |
Add Townes Van Zandt as well. He's a good example too cause that first album with all the orchestra mush over top everything is completely inferior to the later stripped down rerecordings of those songs on later albums. Especially this "Waitin' Around to Die" (1968) vs. "Waitin' Around to Die" (1969)
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Rejoice in the Lord, O ye righteous; praise is meet for the upright. Give praise to the Lord with the harp, chant unto Him with the ten-stringed psaltery. Sing unto Him a new song, chant well unto Him with jubilation. For the word of the Lord is true, and all His works are in faithfulness. The Lord loveth mercy and judgement; the earth is full of the mercy of the Lord.
- Psalm 33:1-5 |
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Fred Treece
From:
California, USA
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Posted 2 May 2024 9:10 am
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I also agree with the Clyde Mattox summation. I saw the late 70’s Family Band a few times. They had incredible chemistry and dynamics, driving right into what seemed like total train wrecks and coming out of them on a dime, straight ahead, unscathed, smiling. When something’s working for you, don’t mess with it.
I disagree with the comment about the time period 1975 throughout the 80’s being a dying time for pedal steel. Crikey! Are you kidding? It was a golden age for country music, and a revival or renaissance or whatever you want to call it, for instrumental virtuosity. It was filled with iconic licks and solos from great guitarists, fiddlers, harmonicats, banjos, dobros, and TONS of steel guitarists. The reason Willie Nelson didn’t have a steeler in his band was definitely not due to a lack great players available to him, or that the instrument had “fallen out of favor”. |
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Chris Templeton
From:
The Green Mountain State
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