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Post new topic What do you hear wrong in the attached mix?
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Author Topic:  What do you hear wrong in the attached mix?
Dick Wood


From:
Springtown Texas, USA
Post Posted 7 Apr 2017 9:16 am     Reply with quote

I had a friend ask me to add some steel to his project so he sent me the rough mix using Reaper with most of the instruments,singer and a click track.

I recorded my part using Reaper and sent it back for them to add.

When I listened to their remix I heard several things that stuck out with respect to the steel yet they say they don't hear these problems and think it sounds fine.

EDIT: Let me make this easier for you all. I think they rerecorded the song slightly faster than my original copy and tried to add the steel in and it's not only not timed right,it sounds like they cut and pasted parts which screwed up my fills.

https://clyp.it/d4xrr4uh
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Last edited by Dick Wood on 19 Apr 2017 9:48 am; edited 2 times in total
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Leon Campbell


From:
Texas, USA
Post Posted 7 Apr 2017 9:33 am     Reply with quote

Dick, I didn't hear anything wrong with it. Very nice steel playing I think. It's the same tune as Silver Wings or very close. Leon
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Stan Paxton


From:
1/2 & 1/2 Florida and Tenn, USA
Post Posted 7 Apr 2017 10:20 am     Reply with quote

Smile Hey Dick, I'm not a pro, but to me it sounds & feels right, parts with call & response instrumental is real good. Overall, loved your playing. ... Very Happy
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Dick Wood


From:
Springtown Texas, USA
Post Posted 7 Apr 2017 10:54 am     Reply with quote

Listen to my fills from 1:55 through 2:33

They're all out of time with the melody line which isn't how I laid it down against the original track.
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Georg Sørtun


From:
Mandal, VA, Norway & Weeki Wachee, FL, USA
Post Posted 7 Apr 2017 11:16 am     Reply with quote

Clearly sounds out of sync at 2:30 ... steel is lagging behind. Overall timing sounds a bit imprecise and diffuse, as if the various bits (punch-ins) of tracks don't follow the same timing throughout the tune.
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Paul Stauskas


From:
Grand Prairie, TX
Post Posted 7 Apr 2017 1:10 pm     Reply with quote

I didn't notice anything that jumped out of me as out of sync, nice playing!

I did notice the singer using the "th" sound where an 's' would go a few times which sounded weird.
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mtulbert


From:
Plano, Texas 75023
Post Posted 8 Apr 2017 4:45 am     Reply with quote

It does sound a little out of sync to me. They tried to get the starts correct and in most cases they succeeded. You may be right about the tempo Dick. The trails of your licks do not end where they should IMHO. You may want to check the clock rate to see if that is where the discrepancy is.

If they did rerecord it faster I have a program that can increase the tempo of your fills and would be glad to help to get everything on the same tempo. Since there appears to be a slight tempo change, your parts will sound exactly the same just a tad bit faster.
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Dick Wood


From:
Springtown Texas, USA
Post Posted 8 Apr 2017 7:13 am     Reply with quote

Thanks Georg and Mark. You're hearing what I heard. The fills/timing have been altered making them out of sync but they just don't hear it.

They're happy with it so let it be I guess.

This is a religious group that has rewritten Silver Wings into Angel Wings and want to include it on a CD when they get approval.
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Jim Mckay


From:
New Zealand
Post Posted 8 Apr 2017 12:26 pm     Reply with quote

You are right Dick. Definitely out and lead guitar sounds out to me also round 1.50 on. Steel way out at 2.30 almost a beat
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b0b


From:
Northern California
Post Posted 8 Apr 2017 1:28 pm     Reply with quote

Sounds like they moved your track to 2 beats later than where you played it, so that it would be more of a call/response with the guitarist. I think it works except for at the end of the solo, where you're still on the 5 chord after everyone else has resolved to the 1.

Beyond that, the whole mix is muddy. Oh Well
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Paul Stauskas


From:
Grand Prairie, TX
Post Posted 8 Apr 2017 2:37 pm     Reply with quote

b0b wrote:
Sounds like they moved your track to 2 beats later than where you played it, so that it would be more of a call/response with the guitarist. I think it works except for at the end of the solo, where you're still on the 5 chord after everyone else has resolved to the 1.

Beyond that, the whole mix is muddy. Oh Well


Yep, this!
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Jack Stoner


From:
Inverness, Fl
Post Posted 8 Apr 2017 2:43 pm     Reply with quote

When you sent them the track, did you send the entire track? When I track for some remote studio I make sure the track I send is the full track, so its not out of sync. I also send them a full wav file, not an MP3.

This is not to say that they didn't screw it up.
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Charlie McDonald


From:
out of the blue
Post Posted 9 Apr 2017 4:02 am     Reply with quote

They got artistic.
If they took that much license with the lyrics, I guess they can do anything.
The sound you were getting was good, and I might not have known had you not pointed it out.
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John Booth


From:
Columbus Ohio, USA
Post Posted 9 Apr 2017 5:05 am     Reply with quote

Sounds like you played it very well, and they took a lot of digital freedom doing the cut/paste with your track.

Not unusual with today's recording techniques.
JB
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Dick Wood


From:
Springtown Texas, USA
Post Posted 9 Apr 2017 1:15 pm     Reply with quote

Jack,I did send the whole track along with the rough mix which included the click track. I tried sending a wave file but it was bigger than AOL's max of 25MB so I had to send it as an MP3.

I agree there's been some cut and paste going on and it sticks out badly as I know what my fills sounded like before they got ahold of them.
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Marco Schouten


From:
Assendelft, The Netherlands
Post Posted 10 Apr 2017 1:16 am     Reply with quote

Dick, I recognize this completely. I work frequently with someone for who I record steel tracks. After he receives it, he cuts it up, uses the parts he wants and sometimes shifts them a bit, making the timing different than I intended.
The way I feel now: OK, you're the producer, I've done my part and you are happy with it....do as you please with it.
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Dick Wood


From:
Springtown Texas, USA
Post Posted 10 Apr 2017 5:08 am     Reply with quote

Hi Marco, You are right and that's what I decided to do but it's hard to not want it to be right. Have a great day.
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Marco Schouten


From:
Assendelft, The Netherlands
Post Posted 11 Apr 2017 12:53 am     Reply with quote

Dick, if you want to send large files you can use websites like Wetransfer.com. Did you use the XLR output on your Quilter for the recording? That's what I use.
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mtulbert


From:
Plano, Texas 75023
Post Posted 11 Apr 2017 3:40 am     Reply with quote

It is always a catch 22 doing remote recordings for the problems and issues that Dick had to endure. It may be true that the Producer can do whatever he desires with what is recorded, but the fact is that Dick will be listed as the steel player and many will hear what has been done as a direct reflection on him.

I can remember in my Nashville days back in the 70's doing some of the most awful sounding mixes that I had ever heard, but my name and the recording studio name was still on the back of the box.

While the tracks may be the property of the producers, they should still be working to show what the intent of the player was. I can understand maybe dropping out a part but to not align it correctly is a major snafu on their part and even if they are happy with the results.
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Greg Lambert


From:
Illinois, USA
Post Posted 11 Apr 2017 6:38 am     Reply with quote

a little glitch at 2:30. Also a a little delay and or reverb on the singer would bring this song up to par.
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Chris Walke


From:
St Charles, IL
Post Posted 14 Apr 2017 4:36 am     Reply with quote

Dick Wood wrote:
Jack,I did send the whole track along with the rough mix which included the click track. I tried sending a wave file but it was bigger than AOL's max of 25MB so I had to send it as an MP3.

I agree there's been some cut and paste going on and it sticks out badly as I know what my fills sounded like before they got ahold of them.


I had a lap steel session for a songwriter friend of mine. I came up with a beginning to end part and I was happy with it. Came in, played it thru. Then they said to do a few more passes, just playing different stuff throughout. "Just go crazy with it," they said.

So I played a few passes as directed. When the album was finished, I was happy with what was there, but it was not the part I worked up, and not any of the passes straight thru. They sliced & diced the takes and created a part that was all me, but I had never played it - so when my buddy asked me to play at his album release show, I had to learn my part...which was only sort of my part.
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Fred Treece


From:
California, USA
Post Posted 19 Apr 2017 8:14 am     Reply with quote

Your playing is very tasteful. It survives the timing issue because of the overall spaciness of the production. I noticed the ending mostly. Your steel seems to be doing a IV-I tag while the rest of the band is holding the I chord. I think they should have followed you.

I'm struggling to refrain from commenting on the artistic choice of re-writing the lyrics to this great classic pearl. But this ain't Facebook, so I'll just say thank you very much for posting your work.
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Dick Wood


From:
Springtown Texas, USA
Post Posted 19 Apr 2017 9:47 am     Reply with quote

Thank you for the compliments.

After comparing the original rough cut where I added my parts,it's obvious to me they rerecorded the whole song and cut and pasted my parts in which in some areas caused my licks to be out of time so it is what it is I guess.
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Fred Treece


From:
California, USA
Post Posted 19 Apr 2017 11:57 pm     Reply with quote

What it is, is a producer taking his artistic license to an extreme. All due respect, it is your name that goes on the credits after "Pedal Steel Guitar:", not the producer's. Listeners will be passing judgment on the player's skill and will not care about what the producer had in mind for the song. The track may not belong to you, but your reputation does.

Sorry for the rant. I would have been plenty ticked off if somebody had done that to me.
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