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Post new topic Shipping Damages. Who makes claim with shipping company?
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Author Topic:  Shipping Damages. Who makes claim with shipping company?
Tony Prior


From:
Charlotte NC
Post  Posted 31 Jan 2017 11:35 am    
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how about get back to the question. this is not about packing properly, we have discussed that 1000 times, it's not about which carrier is better or worse, the question is

WHO FILES the claim for damage or loss ?

It's an easy answer...

"The one who filled out the paperwork and paid the carrier"

That can be the buyer or the seller.

How can it be the buyer you say ? easy, the buyer has an account , does the shipping label online and sends it to the seller to be placed on the package.

The carrier is not even responsible to discuss the shipment with the other party and many times will not, how could they confirm who they are talking to ?

In my selling transactions, I am the shipper , I fill out the paperwork and pay the carrier. I am the insured, how do I know this ? because the forms say so for both Fed Ex and UPS.
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Ian Worley


From:
Sacramento, CA
Post  Posted 31 Jan 2017 11:40 am    
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thanks for clearing that up
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Lane Gray


From:
Topeka, KS
Post  Posted 31 Jan 2017 12:18 pm    
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Indeed. I think I mentioned that somewhere in my words.
BUT even if the buyer pays the carrier, the buyer is at the mercy of the seller for proper preparation. Unless the seller presents it to the carrier to be packed by the carrier. In the event of damage, there's now a three way fight, with the carrier insisting the shipment was improperly prepped.
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J R Rose

 

From:
Keota, Oklahoma, USA
Post  Posted 31 Jan 2017 1:09 pm    
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Right On Lane. That was what I was trying to say that it is the seller/shipper's responsibly to pack the guitar right. Also as Tony was saying it is the person that pays the carrier with cash, credit card, check or an account they are the one that has to file the claim.
Thankfully I have never had this problem. J.R. Rose
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John Billings


From:
Ohio, USA
Post  Posted 31 Jan 2017 5:19 pm    
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I've never had damage. Knock on wood. But I have known the owner of the UPS store for 30 years. I pay for them to pack it, but he lets me help, and I get him to take pics of the process. I supply the wood shims, and old towels and tons of old socks to pack the guitar tight. Never have had a problem.
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Damir Besic


From:
Nashville,TN.
Post  Posted 31 Jan 2017 6:43 pm    
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I don't think shipper is responsible for damage done by carrier, exmp. for UPS dropping guitar off the truck... if buyers don't like that, they are always welcome to come pick up guitar in person... I always wrap guitar in bubble wrap inside the case, and pay UPS to pack it, and I always buy extra insurance for the full value of the instrument... that way I have everything covered ... shipping is always a risk, and if buyer/seller don't want to take a chance, buying guitar in person is the only solution...
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Lane Gray


From:
Topeka, KS
Post  Posted 31 Jan 2017 7:06 pm    
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Damir, if a guitar arrives in an unplayable condition, I won't pay for it. Either PayPal or the credit card association (Visa, Mastercard et cetera) will handle the dispute unless I paid the carrier. If the seller pays the carrier, the carrier is the agent of the seller.
I suspect that, given that it's your business, you pack to survive the likely bumps. In which case there's no problem.
But until it gets to me, it's not my responsibility, not my risk.
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Damir Besic


From:
Nashville,TN.
Post  Posted 31 Jan 2017 7:11 pm    
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Lane, I agree, same thing here, if you ship your guitar to me...
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Henry Matthews


From:
Texarkana, Ark USA
Post  Posted 1 Feb 2017 7:08 am    
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Lane Gray wrote:
Damir, if a guitar arrives in an unplayable condition, I won't pay for it. Either PayPal or the credit card association (Visa, Mastercard et cetera) will handle the dispute unless I paid the carrier. If the seller pays the carrier, the carrier is the agent of the seller.
I suspect that, given that it's your business, you pack to survive the likely bumps. In which case there's no problem.
But until it gets to me, it's not my responsibility, not my risk.


Too late Lane, if you buy a guitar off the forum, you pay for it even before it's ever shipped. You may try to get your money back and honest sellers will return it but if not, you are stuck with a broken guitar that you have already paid for.

I have always thought that there should be another way to buy or sell items like here on forum. Maybe send half money and you pay other half on receiving the goods, I don't know but I have always thought it doesn't seem right to send a perfect stranger x amount of dollars before I have anything in my possession. That may be another thread, I'll quit before the forum police above stops me.
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Lane Gray


From:
Topeka, KS
Post  Posted 1 Feb 2017 7:26 am    
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I suspect that's within normal thread drift, Henry.
And it's NOT too late.
Credit card systems and PayPal both have dispute resolution systems that would almost certainly garner a refund. If the transaction results in a broken guitar, you get your money back.
I've only had one item arrive damaged, an amp head, and the seller had the UPS store pack it. When it dropped, the output and power trannies pulled the chassis down off the J nuts, so the chassis lip had to be straightened and 3 of the 6x6L6s were shattered.
The Seller didn't want to pay me back, and UPS said it was improperly prepped (no bracing, a ½" sheet of Styrofoam and a singlewall box). I just paid the amp guru $125 and it sounds like a dream
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Andrew Wright

 

From:
Indiana, USA
Post  Posted 1 Feb 2017 8:46 am    
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I've shipped well over 100 instruments over the last ten years, and received just as many.

Technically, the person who pays for the label files the claim, as others have correctly suggested.

From an ethical perspective, I've always taken the perspective that the seller is responsible for the item arriving safely. When I was actively dealing in high end acoustic guitars, I carried an insurance policy to give me protection for that reason. Whether it was UPS or FedEx or whomever that dropped the thing, it's my job to get it to the buyer safely or it's my problem to resolve.
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Damir Besic


From:
Nashville,TN.
Post  Posted 1 Feb 2017 8:59 am    
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its not a nuclear science, first of all, serious damage rarely happens, and second just have them pack it, and buy insurance to cover the full value of the instrument, and you are good to go... I received guitars with bell cranks falling off, pull rods hanging under the guitar, bent tuning keys, even cross shafts knocked out of the place, last damage I had was screw that holds the pick up got loose, and scratch the end plate... ha well, with things like that I don't even bother shipper, I just fix it, I don't think seller is responsible for that, steel guitars have lots of little parts, and in shipping that stuff sometimes gets out of place...its not like shipping a guitar, or saxophone ... in all my 30 years of playing, shipping, and receiving steel guitars, I don't remember ever getting guitar that was trashed or broken, or even cracked... those are extremely rare occasions ... once I had UPS damaged the case, but they paid for a new case after claim was filed...
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Zeke Cory


From:
Hinsdale, New York USA
Post  Posted 2 Feb 2017 4:39 am     Lane ..... Don't believe Paypal ...
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Don't believe Paypal will go much out of their way to help a seller. I sold a guitar and shipped from New York to Arizona. I received pictures from the buyer showing the tuning keys had all been damaged. It was packed properly and securely. The buyer then reversed the credit card payment and disappeared with the guitar. I asked both Ebay and Paypal for help. Both said they would help me get the guitar back. Neither one did anything. I lost the guitar and had to pay back Paypal the sale price. They are both crooks and don't care after they have your money. Don't trust either of them to help you much.
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J R Rose

 

From:
Keota, Oklahoma, USA
Post  Posted 2 Feb 2017 6:57 am    
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Zeke, I do not understand the (reversed credit card payment), well I do but I thought once your card was charged that was it? Did your buyer stop payment on his card and then kept the guitar. That is nothing but a THIEF. That is like stop payment on a personal check. J.R.
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Zeke Cory


From:
Hinsdale, New York USA
Post  Posted 2 Feb 2017 8:36 am     J.R. the payment was stopped
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After the guitar reached the buyer, he notified me of the damage. I replied I would file a claim which I did in good faith. After a few days, I got a notice from Paypal that there had been a stop payment or whatever you call it by the buyers credit card company. He obviously initiated that. I emailed the buyer several times until the emails came back undeliverable. When all was said and done, I contacted Ebay and Paypal and asked for help. Both said they would help get my guitar back, but were unable to do anything. Credit card companies will stop payments for various reasons if initiated by the card holder. So I just had to take a loss on that one. Don't trust Ebay, Paypal, or UPS. It will eventually cost ya. jmho.
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Lane Gray


From:
Topeka, KS
Post  Posted 2 Feb 2017 9:12 am    
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PayPal has full banking information on the guy. I'd initiate a fraud/theft case with your local police, and report the guitar stolen (but not stollen).
The cops should be able to subpoena the PayPal records.
The problem is not that PayPal/eBay are crooks, the problem is that a crook abused an essential system.
And in your case, it wasn't even PayPal that took your money, but Visa/Mastercard took it back.
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