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Post new topic Why no 8 string E6?
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Author Topic:  Why no 8 string E6?
Brooks Montgomery


From:
Idaho, USA
Post Posted 9 Jan 2017 9:30 pm     Reply with quote

OK, Please, one of you 8 string lap tuning-and-theory masters explain to me why there is no 8 string E6 tuning used out there (at least on all the charts that I've looked at) that is (low to high):
C#--E--G#--B--C#--E--G#--B
Is it a string gauge thing? Or am I having a brain fart?

Like the popular Western swing A6 & C6
6-1-3-5-6-1-3-5 ??
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Ken Pippus


From:
Lake Oswego, OR
Post Posted 9 Jan 2017 10:31 pm     Reply with quote

All the E13 variants contain the 6, but with more harmonic potential. On Don Helms E13, he played almost exclusively the E6 "piece."
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b0b


From:
Northern California
Post Posted 9 Jan 2017 11:21 pm     Reply with quote

You can't tune a string to high B without it breaking.

Having the 1st string as a middle B would turn the instrument into a baritone, which isn't very popular.
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David M Brown


From:
California, USA
Post Posted 10 Jan 2017 4:06 am     Re: Why no 8 string E6? Reply with quote

Brooks Montgomery wrote:

Is it a string gauge thing? ?


b0b has it right, the strings cannot tune high enough. That's why most E tunings have E or G# as the high pitch.

As for being too low when tuned to the low octave B, some players use a G6 tuning on Dobro thais is low to high:

G B D E G B

with the same middle-register B on top, so it works for them.

I would prefer my 6 string G6 to be BDEGBD, though.

It's a matter of taste.
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Stefan Robertson


From:
London, UK
Post Posted 10 Jan 2017 5:17 am     Reply with quote

Absolutely right.

b0b Answered.
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Brooks Montgomery


From:
Idaho, USA
Post Posted 10 Jan 2017 5:56 am     Reply with quote

b0b wrote:
You can't tune a string to high B without it breaking.

Having the 1st string as a middle B would turn the instrument into a baritone, which isn't very popular.


Thanks b0b, that's exactly the answer I was looking for , and you kept me from bending up some good strings to find that out. I forget sometimes that string gauge can only compensate so much to keep something in the register. Which qualifies as brain fart.
Had a feeling that's why there was no E6 in Slide Rules.
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b0b


From:
Northern California
Post Posted 10 Jan 2017 9:17 am     Reply with quote

If someone wanted a baritone E6th, perhaps as a novelty on a triple or quad neck, the low string should probably be B instead of C#. The C#-E interval would turn to mud in the low register.

B E G# B C# E G# B

The classic E6th is just six strings with a high G# - the Don Helms "Hank Williams" sound. Don never used his bottom 2 strings on a Hank record. He tuned them to A and C#, so it wasn't a true E6th. It's a Real Good Idea, though!

A C# E G# B C# E G#

The only bar slant I ever saw him do was a forward slant on the bottom 3 strings for the 2nd inversion of a major chord (5 1 3).
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David M Brown


From:
California, USA
Post Posted 10 Jan 2017 12:43 pm     Reply with quote

b0b wrote:


The only bar slant I ever saw him do was a forward slant on the bottom 3 strings for the 2nd inversion of a major chord (5 1 3).


Well, that's saying something. He sure got a lot of music out of straight bars.
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Brooks Montgomery


From:
Idaho, USA
Post Posted 10 Jan 2017 1:23 pm     Reply with quote

Do you guys know anybody that's messed with this:

E7 >>>>>> E6

1 - E
2 - B
3 - G#
4 - E
5 - D >>>>>>>rolling back to C#
6 - B
7 - G#
8 - E

It seems like it would be versatile E7 or E6 with a little tuning tweak.
Is it limiting in ways that I can't see? I think I will mess with it, as I don't have to restring to try it.
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Stephen Abruzzo


From:
Philly, PA
Post Posted 10 Jan 2017 1:34 pm     Reply with quote

Brooks.....if you take string #4 and make that an F#, you can have a whole lot of fun.

That is Mike Neer's version of E9 and the B-D-F# in the middle makes a nice Bm chord.

Your bottom 4 strings still gives you a straight E7.

So, the way this tuning plays out it gives you lots of option for all kinds of music.
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Brooks Montgomery


From:
Idaho, USA
Post Posted 10 Jan 2017 1:56 pm     Reply with quote

Thanks Stephen. I'll mess with that. My brain (what's left of it) seems to gravitate to the tunings that have the 1-3-5's laid out in there. My dobro playing comfort zone.
I appreciate the feedback.
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Mark Eaton


From:
Sonoma County in The Great State Of Northern California
Post Posted 10 Jan 2017 3:27 pm     Reply with quote

b0b wrote:
You can't tune a string to high B without it breaking.

Having the 1st string as a middle B would turn the instrument into a baritone, which isn't very popular.


Trying to wrap my head around this. Are you saying the high B 1st string we're talking about here is (in theory) an octave higher than the 2nd string B on both standard guitar and G tuned dobro?

And in Brooks' original question the 5th string B is the same pitch as the the aforementioned 2nd string B on standard guitar or G tuned dobro, and it is not an octave lower than 2nd string standard guitar/dobro B, or the same pitch on the 5th string B of a G tuned dobro?
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Jeff Mead


From:
London, England
Post Posted 10 Jan 2017 4:03 pm     Reply with quote

Mark Eaton wrote:

Trying to wrap my head around this. Are you saying the high B 1st string we're talking about here is (in theory) an octave higher than the 2nd string B on both standard guitar and G tuned dobro?

And in Brooks' original question the 5th string B is the same pitch as the the aforementioned 2nd string B on standard guitar or G tuned dobro, and it is not an octave lower than 2nd string standard guitar/dobro B, or the same pitch on the 5th string B of a G tuned dobro?


The original question was asking about (low to high)

C#--E--G#--B--C#--E--G#--B

This would effectively be the same as A6 moved up 7 frets or down 5 frets.

If the former, you would be talking about the B on the top string being an octave higher than a standard guitar string and the 5th string being the same pitch as a standard guitar B string.

If lowered, of course, toy would have a standard guitar B as the highest string and the low B would be the note you find on fret 2 of a standard guitar's A string.

b0b was absolutely right - the high tuning would be physically impossible and the low one considered a baritone tuning.

The more common E6 tuning has either G# on top (4 semitones higher than regular guitar high E string) or E (same as guitar top E string.
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b0b


From:
Northern California
Post Posted 10 Jan 2017 4:03 pm     Reply with quote

I didn't know which he meant, so I gave the reasons for both. If the first string would be the high B (above pedal steel G#), it would break. If it was a middle B (like dobro string 2), the 7th and 8th strings would be in baritone range.
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Mark Eaton


From:
Sonoma County in The Great State Of Northern California
Post Posted 10 Jan 2017 4:23 pm     Reply with quote

Okay guys, I think I got it.
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