The Steel Guitar Forum Store 

Post new topic Avid ProTools 12....a question or two...
Reply to topic
Author Topic:  Avid ProTools 12....a question or two...
DG Whitley


Post  Posted 16 Jun 2015 5:53 pm    
Reply with quote

Those of you that use Avid ProTools, did you just buy and install or did you read the minimum requirements before you installed?

From what I've read, there are some "tweaks" they want you to preform prior to installation. Just wondering how many of you did those or did you just install and be done with it?

Just curious. I'm considering buying it but I'm not overly enthused to optimize my system to one application that might interfere with other applications.

Your thoughts/guidance appreciated before I decide to buy.
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

Tony Prior


From:
Charlotte NC
Post  Posted 17 Jun 2015 12:44 am    
Reply with quote

typically Pro Tools or any other large app program lives on it's own PC or Mac.

I do not run 12 , I run 8 on it's own dedicated PC, optimized . The biggest issue you will have with other apps is sharing RAM. DAW's do not like that. What are you loading it on, Win7 , Win 8 , how much Ram, MAC..? 12 is known to have more stuff so I am not surprised that optimization is a recommendation.

What other apps are loaded and running in the background that will require some RAM ?

Generally speaking, when optimizing what you are really doing is shutting down all other apps that have nothing to do with sharing RAM or processor usage. IF you are typically going to run small projects with not that many tracks and effects in the BINs, you probably do not need to optimize. Just be aware of how many effects are being used ( occurrences) on one project at the same time across multiple tracks. Pro Tools will let you know when your PC or MAC has reached it's limit ! Shocked

I have been running 8 for several years on it's own WIN XP / PC where the max ram is 4 gig ( actually 3.5 in the real world) , no other programs running on the PC, no internet and the only APP running under Pro Tools that causes any issues is Fender Amplitube , which is a memory hog but they tell you it is so it's not a shock.

It appears on the Pro Tools forums that those that are doing large projects and perhaps with video as well run into resource issues when they do not build a PC or MAC to go along with the DAW. Pro Tools gets a bad rap by many people but at the same time many that complain are running out of resources and blaming the software ! Thats like running out of gas and blaming the car !

" I hate Pro Tools, it uses up all my PC resources, what could they be thinking "

uhmm... I think they were thinking it's a professional DAW package that allows the user ( engineer) to be totally creative and have no restrictions when developing a project.

Like all powerful DAW's ,Pro Tools has countless ways to get to the same end result, if you use a path that requires using RAM resources in real time then yes, cause and effect will occur, especially on multiple tracks at the same time, and then a complaint follows .

My rule number one is use as little LIVE resources as possible and keep the buffers set appropriate so there is no latency and let the DAW do it's thing. My average tracks per project is right around 10 or 12 using busses for effects if and when possible .

Here's an example of a track edit vs using a live resource. I have had this discussion with other users on the forums. IF a section of a track is either to low or to high in gain, I highlight the section and using the envelope tools, either add or subtract gain and save. NO resources used. Others argue with me telling me a better way is to use the auto fader during playback as it does the same thing without editing the track. Well ok, but if the track envelope needs editing then whats the point ? Auto Fader uses PC resources and if we are doing that multiple times then things add up. Either the track needs an edit or not, if it does then why hide behind the bush ? I suppose if you have 16 gig of Ram then this may not be a concern, so it gets back to knowing whats going on, know what you have, know what else is running in the background using resources. Know your system...

The primary purpose of optimizing is not to actually run the DAW, it's to be free to use as many of the " under the hood" items as desired while running the program.

Hope this helps , 12 is a great program.

t
_________________
Emmons L-II , Fender Telecasters, B-Benders
Pro Tools 12 on WIN 7 !
jobless- but not homeless- now retired 9 years

CURRENT MUSIC TRACKS AT > https://tprior2241.wixsite.com/website
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website

DG Whitley


Post  Posted 17 Jun 2015 2:35 am    
Reply with quote

Thanks Tony, that explains a lot. I'm running Win 8.1 with 16 Gig of ram, so hopefully that will help. Most likely I would run PT alone when I'm recording/editing as to avail as much resources to it as possible.

Speaking of video, I did look at their NLE Media Composer, but that requires an I7 chip minimum and I'm running an I5, and don't plan to do a chip upgrade anytime soon. I'll stick with my Adobe suite for any of that.

Thanks so much again for your reply, deeply appreciated. I look forward to getting into the recording part of music. This will be interesting.
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

mtulbert


From:
Plano, Texas 75023
Post  Posted 17 Jun 2015 4:00 am    
Reply with quote

Hi DG,

Good question and Tony's answer will give you a lot of guidance down this journey. I am running PT 11 on a Windows 7 PC with 16 gigs of ram and I have no problems with it running at all.

However I do not use alot of plug ins which from what I understand is the real resource hog in Pro Tools. Tony can correct me if I am wrong. If you just recording basic tracks you should be fine IMHO. When I do remote recordings I use an old laptop with an AMD processor on it and I am not even sure of the ram in the laptop. I am able to record 24 tracks with no hiccups what so ever. I then transfer the session to my desktop and do the mixing there.

What I would recommend is that you should use solid state drives if you can. the read and writes on these devices may be the reason I don't need a dedicated PC for Pro Tools. I will be glad to talk to you as well if you have any other questions. Hopefully with the info given to you by Tony and myself and you can have a trouble free fun time with Pro Tools.

Mark
_________________
Mark T


Rittenberry Laquer D10, Rittenberry Prestige SD10, Revelation Preamp,Revelation Octal Preamp,Lexicon PCM 92 Reverb, Furlong Cabinet
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

Tony Prior


From:
Charlotte NC
Post  Posted 17 Jun 2015 5:10 am    
Reply with quote

Win 7 and Win 8 with lots of Ram is a good thing, I doubt anyone will run into issues on small to medium projects, but it is also based on how many occurrences are running under PT's as well. I have no issues even with XP and 4 gig ram, but I am a cautious. Windows has a nasty habit of letting things run in the background even though you don't know it . I would remove as many programs as possible from the Start menu. Go grab them when you need them. Pro Tools does have a setting asking how much of the CPU should be made available to run....I think default is near 75% maybe higher !

I'm not an expert I just have a few years under my belt, my take as always, for any DAW, let it be the main running program on your PC if the PC is shared with other apps. IF it does start to slow down or bog at least you'll know why.

t
_________________
Emmons L-II , Fender Telecasters, B-Benders
Pro Tools 12 on WIN 7 !
jobless- but not homeless- now retired 9 years

CURRENT MUSIC TRACKS AT > https://tprior2241.wixsite.com/website
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website

DG Whitley


Post  Posted 18 Jun 2015 3:25 pm    
Reply with quote

Thanks Tony and Mark, deeply appreciated. I'll have this in before long and we'll see what happens. I'll just have to go with whatever the learning curve is, but I'll try to have fun doing it!
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

Mark van Allen


From:
Watkinsville, Ga. USA
Post  Posted 18 Jun 2015 4:51 pm    
Reply with quote

I'll say again what I alwaYS do to someone steeping in to ProTools, do yourself a favor and get a copy of (the revised version) of John Keane's most excellent guide "ProTools for Musicians". Teaches PT via imaginary sessions, but using the exact skills and tools you WILL use in real life sessions, with humor and insight. Lots of fun and a real good way to get up to speed fast. He also includes the optimization and setup tricks you've been talking about. Great book.
_________________
Stop by the Steel Store at: www.markvanallen.com
www.musicfarmstudio.com
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website

DG Whitley


Post  Posted 18 Jun 2015 5:06 pm    
Reply with quote

Thanks Mark, I'm looking on Amazon now. I can always appreciate some humor during a learning phase, always seems to help with the tough times.
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

Tony Prior


From:
Charlotte NC
Post  Posted 19 Jun 2015 2:14 am    
Reply with quote

What mark says....

Pro Tools , my opinion, is a great program, The issue for many is they try to learn too much at one time. My take, chart your plan, what do you want to accomplish ? learn those basic skills. Build a project, add a few tracks, understand how to get a clean unsaturated signal into the DAW, record a new track while monitoring previous tracks etc.

GO SLOW, a few things at a time, get good a those things, then add more..

Kinda like playing Steel guitar !

Nobody learned how to use Microsoft Office in one sitting...

Currently I am in the process of a 10 song project with a close friend, there are many things I do not know, but as Einstein says, give me 5 minutes and I'll answer any question !

I use GOOGLE and also have two books on my workstation.I'm not afraid to STOP, take a pause, and look something up.

Add things as you need or require them.

ask questions...

tp
_________________
Emmons L-II , Fender Telecasters, B-Benders
Pro Tools 12 on WIN 7 !
jobless- but not homeless- now retired 9 years

CURRENT MUSIC TRACKS AT > https://tprior2241.wixsite.com/website
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website

Bob Hoffnar


From:
Austin, Tx
Post  Posted 19 Jun 2015 4:52 am    
Reply with quote

Tony, what books do you keep handy ?

I tend to bump into goofy problems that can hang me up for hours. Like why is the waveform graphic on the tracks I'm recording on a different scale then the pre recorded tracks ?
_________________
Bob
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website

Mark van Allen


From:
Watkinsville, Ga. USA
Post  Posted 19 Jun 2015 8:23 am    
Reply with quote

Hi, Bob, as with many of my interests I've read as many books on PT as I can find, some immensely useful, others near useless. The Keane book is just great for getting up and running, and bypassing much unneeded wandering to get right into tracking actual sessions. For your kind of question I've found Jose Valenzuela's shortcuts book something I go back to again and again. You can just look in the TOC under something like "View- track size" and go right to the page with the keyboard shortcuts to resize the track window you're working on. http://www.amazon.com/The-Complete-Pro-Tools-Shortcuts/dp/142349279X


I assume it's the same for most people, I've learned settings and shortcuts for things I do all the time, but the ones I use less frequently slip out of the memory bank. I have some notebooks around with notes for the fixes and moves I've had to look up so I have my own reference book tailored to my needs and failing memory!
_________________
Stop by the Steel Store at: www.markvanallen.com
www.musicfarmstudio.com
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website

Tony Prior


From:
Charlotte NC
Post  Posted 21 Jun 2015 12:57 am    
Reply with quote

Like Mark, I take notes, lots of them and keep them handy. Kinda like my own quick start... The books I have are the two in the photo, both have value but the LE 8 book has a bit more technical detail, but I use them both. I also use google and U-Tube, as there are many fast answers on both.

I find that at this point, probably 75% of what I do I just do, I am also now getting very familiar with the menu bar and drop down items. Many times the answer is right in front of me and finding it even borders on common sense.

But also, before I retired, I was selling and using very hi end technical analytical software which makes Pro Tools look like Romper Room ! Laughing So software and seeking info is and has been part of my life for years !

For me , the key is always, baby steps, a few things at a time, then add a couple..take notes. Remember , the definition of quality software is flexibility, not complexity. Think Bill Murray here !




_________________
Emmons L-II , Fender Telecasters, B-Benders
Pro Tools 12 on WIN 7 !
jobless- but not homeless- now retired 9 years

CURRENT MUSIC TRACKS AT > https://tprior2241.wixsite.com/website
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website

Tony Prior


From:
Charlotte NC
Post  Posted 5 Sep 2015 4:24 am    
Reply with quote

Just an update...

I have reached the point where the upgrade to a later version Windows and newer Pro Tools has arrived, not because of Pro Tools 8 but rather the XP Platform and PC cannot support other upgrades. Modern upgrades ! Laughing


I purchased PT 12 ( perpetual license) , I have a new 29"( 4K) Monitor and am in the process of building another PC which will be WIN 7 with 16 gig of ram. This , like the XP/PC will be a dedicated recording PC. Clean from crud and other apps.

PT 8 has been great to me as was the XP/PC , but to add the new modern stuff and join those living in 2015....the road was closed ! Crying or Very sad
_________________
Emmons L-II , Fender Telecasters, B-Benders
Pro Tools 12 on WIN 7 !
jobless- but not homeless- now retired 9 years

CURRENT MUSIC TRACKS AT > https://tprior2241.wixsite.com/website
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website

mtulbert


From:
Plano, Texas 75023
Post  Posted 5 Sep 2015 5:08 am    
Reply with quote

Hi Tony

Glad you took the plunge and updated your Pro Tools. Am investigating 12 as well, just not sure if I need it. Don't do that much recording these days.

Just an FYI for you. I took the plunge and upgraded from Windows 7 to 10. It was an experiment and you can always revert back if you want. Although Avid does not actively support Pro Tools under Windows 10, I was amazed at how efficient 10 is. Pro Tools loaded very quickly and has been flawless under it up to this point in time.

Regards,

Mark T.
_________________
Mark T


Rittenberry Laquer D10, Rittenberry Prestige SD10, Revelation Preamp,Revelation Octal Preamp,Lexicon PCM 92 Reverb, Furlong Cabinet
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

Tony Prior


From:
Charlotte NC
Post  Posted 5 Sep 2015 7:06 am    
Reply with quote

Hey Mark, yes good stuff about 7 and 10....I decided to go to 7 as it is a well know platform,understood to be mostly reliable. With the new 7 PC and 12 I can go to 10 should I decide to at a later date. But I could not upgrade any hardware with XP..I wish 8 ran on 7 ! I certainly did not want to purchase PT's but was kinda forced into it. Plus, all the lower priced upgrades to 12 stopped at 9, go figure !


It is also my understanding that at some point soon, Avid, per the website, like everyone else, will not offer perpetual licenses , only subscriptions. I grabbed a PT 12 from Sweetwater, Avid licensed and with an Eleven Rack promo. They did guarantee ( written) that it contained a perpetual license. And yes, I negotiated a better price than what they were advertising. MF is offering the same price promo but they do not guarantee that it is a perpetual license, it may be a 3 year subscription paid up front.

welcome to the new world order !

Laughing
_________________
Emmons L-II , Fender Telecasters, B-Benders
Pro Tools 12 on WIN 7 !
jobless- but not homeless- now retired 9 years

CURRENT MUSIC TRACKS AT > https://tprior2241.wixsite.com/website
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website

mtulbert


From:
Plano, Texas 75023
Post  Posted 5 Sep 2015 7:36 am    
Reply with quote

I think Avid is slowly shooting themselves in the foot with this Perpetual License nonsense. I passed on 12 because I am not sure what would happen after a year goes by. Eleven does everything I need it to and even 10 works great. I am not doing the amount of recording that you do so I will look to you in the future for reasons to justify the upgrade.

Good luck with your new venture.
_________________
Mark T


Rittenberry Laquer D10, Rittenberry Prestige SD10, Revelation Preamp,Revelation Octal Preamp,Lexicon PCM 92 Reverb, Furlong Cabinet
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

Jack Stoner


From:
Kansas City, MO
Post  Posted 5 Sep 2015 8:08 am    
Reply with quote

I would also suggest joining or at least look at the www.gearslutz.com forum which is aimed at recording. They have a special section for ProTools, along with the other forum sections.

There are two separate ProTools sections, one for 10 and HDX and another for 11 and 12.


https://www.gearslutz.com/board/music-computers/

I don't use ProTools (I use Sonar) but tweaking systems is the same for all.
_________________
GFI Ultra Keyless S-10 with pad (Black of course) TB202 amp, Hilton VP, Steelers Choice sidekick seat, SIT Strings
Cakewalk by Bandlab and Studio One V4.6 pro DAWs, MOTU Ultralite MK5 recording interface unit
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

Tony Prior


From:
Charlotte NC
Post  Posted 5 Sep 2015 8:30 am    
Reply with quote

Mark, there is no issue with 12 with a Perpetual License, it's a forever thing. Avid, like many other software companies is going to subscriptions with the latest versions. What they offer now is an upgrade annual fee and also a monthly subscription fee which at the end of the day comes out to the same price over a few years as a perpetual license right now. I don't see a reason to upgrade from 11 to 12. I didn't even want to upgrade from 8 to 12, but 12 is all you can get today. I wanted to go from 8 to 9 ! But that ship sailed a few years ago . I could have acquired 9 on EBAY but there is no guarantee it would be honored at registration. Then what ? Fight a war to get $150 back ?

Think Rhapsody, Netflix, even Microsoft Office is doing the same thing now. Monthly usage fees.

12 comes with a one year free upgrade, if I want to pay $99/year I can get all the upgrades from now until eternity, that ain't gonna happen, in 10 or 12 years from now I may not even remember I play guitar ! Smile
_________________
Emmons L-II , Fender Telecasters, B-Benders
Pro Tools 12 on WIN 7 !
jobless- but not homeless- now retired 9 years

CURRENT MUSIC TRACKS AT > https://tprior2241.wixsite.com/website


Last edited by Tony Prior on 7 Sep 2015 4:12 am; edited 1 time in total
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website

Tom Wolverton


From:
Carpinteria, CA
Post  Posted 6 Sep 2015 9:49 pm    
Reply with quote

last year I bought one of the last quad i7 mini macs and made it a dedicated PT machine. I run it with the Avid MBox Pro and Pro Tools 11. I really love it. it has been rock solid.
_________________
To write with a broken pencil is pointless.
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail


All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Jump to:  

Our Online Catalog
Strings, CDs, instruction,
steel guitars & accessories

www.SteelGuitarShopper.com

Please review our Forum Rules and Policies

Steel Guitar Forum LLC
PO Box 237
Mount Horeb, WI 53572 USA


Click Here to Send a Donation

Email admin@steelguitarforum.com for technical support.


BIAB Styles
Ray Price Shuffles for
Band-in-a-Box

by Jim Baron
HTTP