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Topic: Using the A&B pedals |
Jeff Mead
From: London, England
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Posted 25 Jul 2015 3:03 pm
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I am in the process of trying to learn some pedal steel after a fair few years of playing lap steel.
I'm currently working my way through the A&B pedal part of Jeff Newman's "Up from The Top" course.
I came across an old thread where someone posted this clip of Buddy Charleton playing with the Texas Troubadours and said that on the E9 parts of the tune, Buddy was only using the A and B pedals.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=ViY2WXvVXYU&list=PLtACECI7H6zPUX0TyTdEt7ZFMu18zjefE
Apart from enjoying his amazing playing, it got me thinking I'd love to find some more examples of great steel playing just using the A&B pedals.
Also is there any tab or online lessons showing some licks like in the clip - I'm not sure what I would search for. |
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Craig Baker
From: Eatonton, Georgia, USA - R.I.P.
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Lane Gray
From: Topeka, KS
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Posted 25 Jul 2015 3:40 pm
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Bud's Bounce. _________________ 2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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Craig Baker
From: Eatonton, Georgia, USA - R.I.P.
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Posted 25 Jul 2015 4:08 pm
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Good call Lane.
Tom Brumley did an excellent recording of Bud's Bounce. It's my favorite version. . . and of course I don't have a copy of it.
Best regards,
Craig Baker 706-485-8792
cmbakerelectronics@gmail.com
C.M. Baker Electronics
P.O. Box 3965
Eatonton, GA 31024 _________________ "Make America Great Again". . . The Only Country With Dream After Its Name. |
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Jeff Mead
From: London, England
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Posted 25 Jul 2015 4:53 pm
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Craig Baker wrote: |
Hi Jeff,
First things first. . . When you say the name Charleton, that tells me you have great taste in music.
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Hi Craig,
I have pretty wide taste in music but have always had a particular fondness for ET in particular and late 50's to mid 60's country in general. The steel on the early Johnny Paycheck stuff with Lloyd Green, the Loretta Lynn stuff, the George Jones and George/Tammy recordings.
I've always been interested in pedal steel but there is something about that stuff that is a bit more edgy than some of the later, smoother styles.
Regarding my own playing, I see myself as mainly a lap steel player and don't see that changing in the near future but really want to learn some pedal steel for my own enjoyment. Of course, if I could get good enough to play pedal steel with a band at some point, that would be wonderful.
Those recordings you posted with the vocals removed and the steel more prominent are amazing and, I must say, pretty much exactly what I aspire to be able to play. If I can get somewhere in that ballpark, I'll be very happy. I could really see some of those licks working in other areas of music too.
So I can pretty much ignore everything apart from the pedals then Of course, I realise that isn't the case but it's encouraging that I should be able to get into the ballpark if I really work on the basics. I can understand what the point is of all the levers (and the C pedal) even if my feet and knees won't co-operate 100% yet - my steel is a S10, 3x5.
My question is, there any learning material or TAB specifically for the Buddy Charleton/Ernest Tubb style of pedal steel? |
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Tom Cooper
From: Orlando, Fl
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Posted 25 Jul 2015 5:29 pm
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Hey Jeff. Great post. I too started out on dobro, then went straight to big rig D10 then to D8 non pedal and really got into D8. Got called back to pedal steel but still play D8 in rockabilly band. Picked up a U12 thinking it would be lighter and easier. Not really. still lots of breaking down and setting up. Then lo and behold a little Emmons GS10 push pull fell in my lap(pun). I traded a squier tele for it. Bass player friend picked it up for nothing at estate sale. Anyway, it has fantastic tone and is so easy to just pick up and go with. I realized that most of stuff I do for people is just 3 and 1 anyway. I have been really getting into making the most of 3x1. I will probably add E raise and one more knee just for dim, aug and 7th chords but thats it. Just starting a jazz trio so U12 will be main steel for that, D10 for backup, but my main gigging pedal steel is the little 3x1. I have a non pedal mentality a lot. Was hard at first to adjust. Buddy Charlton and ET are huge favorites of mine as well. I could just live in that music. I kinda do actually. I change my spots for the gig but always go back to that era. Edgy is great discription. I love to dig in with those picks! When appropriate. Interesting post. Hope there is more on minimal pedal steel. |
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Craig Baker
From: Eatonton, Georgia, USA - R.I.P.
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Posted 25 Jul 2015 6:59 pm
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Jeff and Tom,
At the risk of seeming "cavalier", it's my opinion that the music Buddy Charleton was playing on E9th was not at all complicated. The notes and chords are not hard to find. The difficult part is getting it to sound good, and to my ears when it comes to making it sound good, Charleton had talent that few can approach.
Jeff, no doubt you'll listen to those songs more than once. An important thing to keep in mind is that during the era of those wonderful recordings, Buddy never raised his Es or lowered his 2nd string, nor did he have any of today's popular changes.
However, nobody is perfect. I saw Buddy Charleton play live many times and heard him hit several mistakes. Each time, I'd run home and try to figure out what he had done so I could put that mistake in a song now and then.
Here's a photo of Buddy. Count all of those knee levers:
Best regards,
Craig Baker 706-485-8792
cmbakerelectronics@gmail.com
C.M. Baker Electronics
P.O. Box 3965
Eatonton, GA 31024 _________________ "Make America Great Again". . . The Only Country With Dream After Its Name. |
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Tom Cooper
From: Orlando, Fl
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Posted 25 Jul 2015 7:50 pm
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Wow. Cool stuff. Seems he got jazz type voicings on C6 or by being creative on E9. Would that be a fair observation? Makes me want to leave it 3x1. |
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Craig Baker
From: Eatonton, Georgia, USA - R.I.P.
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Posted 25 Jul 2015 11:10 pm
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Tom,
Yes, much of the music that I had thought was on C6th turned out to be his creative use of E9th. When he played C6th, he did it so well that as far as I know, he was the only one in Nashville in the '60s who could get away with it. Nashville didn't want C6th in those days, but whatever he played, it always fit perfectly. Of course, the same is true for Leon Rhodes. It's no wonder they were called "The Great Band"
On the other hand, I've always enjoyed Hank Thompson's music and I can't think of any his tunes that weren't played on C6th. Here's an ad I came across. Apparently there may be some teaching material available; it's well known that he was an excellent instructor.
Best regards,
Craig Baker 706-485-8792
cmbakerelectronics@gmail.com
C.M. Baker Electronics
P.O. Box 3965
Eatonton, GA 31024 _________________ "Make America Great Again". . . The Only Country With Dream After Its Name. |
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Jeff Mead
From: London, England
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Posted 26 Jul 2015 12:25 am
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Thanks guys for all your replies so far.
Maybe someone can help me on a specific lick.
I think "deceptively simple" might be the phrase I'm looking for.
The descending lick in the beginning of the solo to "Pass The Booze".
I hear, basically the classic "b-bender" or AB pedal lick:
Assuming the song is in the key of A, I hear:
strings 4 and 5 at 12th fret squeezing the A pedal in.
Then the same at fret 10 and then at 7.
But when I play it, it doesn't sound the same, it almost sounds like there needs to be another note in there somewhere but not the obvious one (string 6 with B pedal engaged). It somehow has a jazzy sound to it.
Does anyone else know what I mean or am I going crazy?
This is just one example but I'm hearing it a lot on those Buddy Charleton/ET tracks where I can hear the main bit he's doing but there's something else there that eludes me.
I'll definitely investigate that 50 intros/turnarounds book - thanks. |
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Ian Rae
From: Redditch, England
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Posted 26 Jul 2015 3:28 am
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Craig Baker wrote: |
Here's a photo of Buddy. Count all of those knee levers: |
I've said this on another thread, but my first PSG was an old D10 with the full eight pedals but just one lever. Suggests you can do a lot with just those, especially if you are interested in earlier styles of playing. _________________ Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs |
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Craig Baker
From: Eatonton, Georgia, USA - R.I.P.
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Posted 26 Jul 2015 4:16 am
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Jeff Meade wrote:
"Does anyone else know what I mean or am I going crazy?"
Jeff, I am sorry to be the one to tell you but the answer is yes. It happens to anyone who tries to figure out what Charleton was doing. I'm convinced that he sat on the edge of his bed every night saying to himself: "Now let's see. . . what can I do tomorrow that will baffle them?"
After all of these years, Buddy Charleton is still my favorite steel player and Leon Rhodes is my favorite guitar player. Looking for a trait common to both men, the only thing that jumps out at me is that they spent much of their careers playing on no more than two strings at a time. I think that's the key that may unlock Pass The Booze.
Best regards,
Craig Baker 706-485-8792
cmbakerelectronics@gmail.com
C.M. Baker Electronics
P.O. Box 3965
Eatonton, GA 31024 _________________ "Make America Great Again". . . The Only Country With Dream After Its Name. |
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Donny Hinson
From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 26 Jul 2015 5:22 am
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Jeff Mead wrote: |
Thanks guys for all your replies so far.
Maybe someone can help me on a specific lick. I think "deceptively simple" might be the phrase I'm looking for. The descending lick in the beginning of the solo to "Pass The Booze". I hear, basically the classic "b-bender" or AB pedal lick: Assuming the song is in the key of A, I hear:
strings 4 and 5 at 12th fret squeezing the A pedal in.
Then the same at fret 10 and then at 7.
But when I play it, it doesn't sound the same, it almost sounds like there needs to be another note in there somewhere but not the obvious one (string 6 with B pedal engaged). It somehow has a jazzy sound to it.
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Another classic lick using just A&B, where technique and "flow" is everything. Get that wrong, and it won't sound the same. But you're right about "another note" - he does add the 6th string and plays a triad when he goes to fret 7. |
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Jeff Mead
From: London, England
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Posted 26 Jul 2015 7:03 am
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Another question for you.
You've said that he mainly used A&B and a knee lever. I also read on another thread that he "never raised his Es or did anything with the first or second strings" so I guess that means the lever lowered his Es?
And by "never did anything with the 1st or 2nd" does that mean he didn't use them at all or he just didn't change them with a lever?
This will all help me with trying to figure out some of those licks. |
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Lane Gray
From: Topeka, KS
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Posted 26 Jul 2015 7:56 am
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He used them. Just neither raised nor lowered. _________________ 2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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Craig Baker
From: Eatonton, Georgia, USA - R.I.P.
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Posted 26 Jul 2015 8:12 am
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Jeff,
Here's a great example of his use of the 1st and 2nd strings. Listen closely to the last part of the intro to E T's version of My Friends Are Gonna Be Strangers. It seems like everything Charleton played was so simple, and yet so impressive. This song was such a big hit for Merle Haggard, he named his band after it.
http://picosong.com/mxnw/
Lane,
I heard that Buddy Charleton had a "Jake Brake" installed on his C6th neck. You might know if that's true or not.
Best regards,
Craig Baker 706-485-8792
cmbakerelectronics@gmail.com
C.M. Baker Electronics
P.O. Box 3965
Eatonton, GA 31024 _________________ "Make America Great Again". . . The Only Country With Dream After Its Name. |
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chris ivey
From: california (deceased)
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Posted 26 Jul 2015 9:49 am
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Donny Hinson wrote: |
Another classic lick using just A&B, where technique and "flow" is everything. Get that wrong, and it won't sound the same. |
a good example of this, as i've mentioned before, is one day long ago when i spent all day chasing a beautifully appropiate lick that i had heard buddy emmons play.
i looked up and down the fretboard until later on i stumbled on the most basic, simple position/pedal that any beginner could do. buddy just did it perfectly! |
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Steve Hitsman
From: Waterloo, IL
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Posted 27 Jul 2015 7:42 am
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Buddy told me himself that he composed "Almost to Tulsa" in his head while taking his turn driving with Ernest and the Troubadours. When they arrived at their destination, he set up his guitar and played it for Leon. He composed it IN HIS HEAD!!!!! |
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Craig Baker
From: Eatonton, Georgia, USA - R.I.P.
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Posted 27 Jul 2015 5:12 pm
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Steve,
I was pretty amazed when he told me that also. I think he had an abundance of creative talent along with an incredible ear and the special gift of knowing exactly what to play, how to phrase it and where it would best fit.
Buddy recorded a revised version of Almost To Tulsa in the early '90s. For those who have never heard it, here you go. . .
Ahhh Buddy now: http://picosong.com/masM
Best regards,
Craig Baker 706-485-8792
cmbakerelectronics@gmail.com
C.M. Baker Electronics
P.O. Box 3965
Eatonton, GA 31024 _________________ "Make America Great Again". . . The Only Country With Dream After Its Name. |
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