My Fingers Can't Handle Finger Picks - HELP!!!!!!!!!!

Bill Hatcher · From: Atlanta Ga. USA

if the shoe fits...wear it.

Todd Clinesmith · From: Lone Rock Free State Oregon

I would not take it so bad. You came off defensive, and then got offensive, which is understandable to a point.
You went over the line, but big deal. You realized it and moved on.
There's lots of good info to be had. Erv's comment was not at all constructive, and tho we all like to have a good time you obviously wanted to be taken seriously, which is once again understandable... to a point.

To add to the conversation, I have been a finger picker most of my musical life, and have a hard time flat picking. When I first started playing guitar I got into Delta and Country Blues. I love the sound of John Hurt who did not play with picks, but I was more driven to play like the players such as Gary Davis and others who used picks. Playing with picks was tough for me. I went back and forth between playing without picks and struggling with picks, till one day it clicked. Long story short is , if that's the sound you're after ...keep after it. Music is like any of the other past times that slowly has it's reward with practice, like golf or fishing or....

Bill Brunt · From: Texas, USA

Don't be so hasty.
Yes, we use first and last names here to remind us to behave like gentlemen, and part of our being gentlemen is our ability to dispense grace.
Your sincere apology speaks more loudly than your initial reaction.

So practice your steel, buy a harmonica, and post a clip of you playing it, just to complete the jokeðŸ˜‰

Erv Niehaus · From: Litchfield, MN, USA

I got a very nice apology in a PM from Wayne and he is truly sorry for coming off as sort of a jerk. I really belive him to be a nice fellow. He just needs more time to get a feel of this particular forum and develop a better rapport with fellow forumites.
He said he was leaving our fellowship but I wish he would stay. Anybody wanting to learn this combination Singer sewing machine and cheese slicer needs all the encouragement he can get! Very Happy

Erv

Mike Neer · From: NJ

Wayne, don't go anywhere. I cannot tell you how many times I embarassed myself with posts on this forum.

You can very easily get used to fingerpicks if a) they are fitted to your fingers comfortably and b) if you practice at it long enough. I still practice quite a bit and it would not be possible if the picks were ill-fitting. Grab some needle nose pliers and manipulate the picks until they fit your fingers like a glove.
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David Slama · From: Black Hills, South Dakota, USA

I think you might like the Propik "fingertone" split wrap picks. These let you use the pulp of your fingers to pick block and you can play with the edge of the pick as well as the tip. Try a couple size medium and a couple size large @ $3.40 a pop (Elderly Instruments) and see what you think.
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Georgeboards S8 Stealth w/Mark Roeder custom stand. Georgeboards S8 boxcar. Rob Ickes Wechter Scheerhorn resonator. 1940's Rickenbacker S6 w/M-10 amp. Little Walter 50W amp & 112 Cabinet. Cobra Coil strings & bar. ProPik "fingertone" split wrap medium

Stefan Robertson · From: Hertfordshire, UK

Wayne

You shouldn't leave because of one confrontation. Here's why...

1. This is the only steel guitar resource forum that is constantly updated.

2. The community is small and we are like a family... And what family doesn't disagree from time to time.

3. Did I mention how small the community is??? We know you by name so it's best to just resolve your issues don't be sensitive and be open to the idea that there will be good posts and bad posts and everything in between.

4. Giving up at the first hurdle is not a good characteristic. Believe me if that is in your character you should not take up Lap Steel Guitar. It ain't easy. So think about that. It's not like guitar where info is plentiful. It takes many conversations and time before people open up and share secrets and even when they do its limited also due to the fact that it's typed a full explanation is sometimes not feasible so you have to connect the dots.

5. Every single person who plays has the potential of being the next revolutionary player or thinker. Let it be you.

6. And Finally no one ever changed hearts and minds from the outside looking in.
_________________
Stefan
Bill Hatcher custom 12 string Lap Steel Guitar
E13#9/F secrets: https://thelapsteelguitarist.wordpress.com

"Give it up for The Lap Steel Guitarist"

David Mason · From: Cambridge, MD, USA

You have luckily and somewhat youngily lucked into THE forum on steel guitar - this joint is really unparalleled by any other instrument-focused one or even, any music forum I've ever seen online. This is the motherload, the panacea, the pillow, the carrot, the stick, the bedbugs in the pillowcase etc. There is a substantial number of people here who simply wouldn't be playing steel and/or, even music, if it wasn't for what they picked up here. AND, I'd guess that MOST (+50%, that) most of us... more dignified ones have had our own battles with discs & verties, trigger fingers, "Abner got the carpal" etc. Might even know something? People SAW their fingers off. People without HANDS play steel guitar. Consequently, this is near-inconceivable:

I have enjoyed what has been my short membership to this forum and will be canceling my membership immediately.

O.K., if I am re-re-re-re-re-re-re-re-re-reading* this correctly, Mr. Shriver's problem is not about getting little bits of metal to stick to his fingertips but rather, the fingers themselves are pointing towards the South Pole, instead of bending down and in to salute China? (tho actually tunneling straight from northeast USA puts you in the Andaman Islands where the salties'll get you if the Sentinel Island cavemen don't get you first.)

*(sorry, my printer got stuck)

Content:
The conventional right-hand strategies are probably 50% designed to produce notes but, also fully 40% -designed* to STOP notes from ringing inappropriately. Steel players refer to "blocking", rock guitarists are hopeless without "palm-muting," Sonny Landreth even just jams a finger or two right down through the strings when he's getting his howl on. Can you just lay your right-hand palm down across the strings at the bridge, and with your thumb resting two or three strings up from the lowest one? And, reasonably pain-free, lift your palm a little while moving? Or if the lifting is hard, can you just slide that "palm-mute" back and forth from a little behind the bridge to a little in front of it? Because that's quite enough capacity to make a whole lot of noise->->-> heading ->->->towards music for a long time. You will probably do better with a bit of modification to the thumbpick blade, shortened & shaped to make UP-strokes blend best with downstrokes, especially if you can't bring an index or middle finger around to grab the thumbpick. If you try that, you do still NEED to keep the palm mute fully "engaged" - it's more important than 2-fingering the pick, and there are all sorts of strategies to get the thumbpick to hang on and all sorts of thumbpicks, a mere refinement of details. This concept is much more about muted being the defauly position, and letting notes just PEEP out, as opposed to banging on the thing and then launching chord triage. And though there are also lots and lots of LEFT-hand silencer work that can be done; too; the above experiment is still necessary.

The greatest caveat, do NOT "play through the pain." Most nerves DON'T grow back, certainly among the mature.... I either worsened or maybe even "caught the carpal" when I mistakenly though ALL my hand(s) pain(s) my infernal neck discs doing the Che Guevara revolution bit.

*(eeep!)

Michael James · From: La Crosse, Wisconsin, USA

I didn't understand Erv's harmonica comment so I ignored it. I spent about a year tying to play the chromatic harmonica. After failing at that I started to play the lap steel. When I think of harmonica, the video below is what I think of. I have a lot respect for great players of that instrument.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q3VJOl_XeGs

David Slama · From: Black Hills, South Dakota, USA

Perhaps I should have been a bit more clear about why the Propik might work in Wayne's situation. This pick style does not require a 90 degree orientation to the strings. There are playing surfaces all over the pick. Wayne, it would allow you to play even if you had a completely frozen wrist and could barely flex your fingers at all. If you can pluck a string with your bare fingers and get a pinch between thumb and index, you could use this pick...even if your elbow was pointing toward Tierra del Fuego. I like these picks because they allow me to feel the strings with my fingers, but still get the hard attack of metal on metal.
_________________
Georgeboards S8 Stealth w/Mark Roeder custom stand. Georgeboards S8 boxcar. Rob Ickes Wechter Scheerhorn resonator. 1940's Rickenbacker S6 w/M-10 amp. Little Walter 50W amp & 112 Cabinet. Cobra Coil strings & bar. ProPik "fingertone" split wrap medium

Erv Niehaus · From: Litchfield, MN, USA

Michael,
Let me clarify my remark: You don't need picks to play a harmonica, OK?

Stefan Robertson · From: Hertfordshire, UK

Stefan Robertson · From: Hertfordshire, UK

My side is hurting. You gave me a stitch. Hahaha.

This forum is classic.
Laughing

_________________
Stefan
Bill Hatcher custom 12 string Lap Steel Guitar
E13#9/F secrets: https://thelapsteelguitarist.wordpress.com

"Give it up for The Lap Steel Guitarist"

W. Johnson · From: Oregon, USA

I also had to quit playing regular guitar, many years ago, due to arthritis. It never occurred to me to try lap steel or pedal steel. I built my first pedal steel guitar, so I could make the chord changes, and I actually strummed it like a regular guitar. I was happy with that, but became intrigued to try and play more like the instrument is intended to be played, making melodies and using chords and triads, etc. Then decided to go with the lap steel, as it's smaller and simpler. I started building and selling lap steels, and then realized I should know how to play it too. Smile

I tried and tried to use finger picks. As I have arthritis in my fingers, finger picks will not stay on. I tried a lot of different picks, none work. Bare fingers do not work either. So, I just use a flat pick. I've seen a few pro players use a flat pick. There are some things a flat pick cannot do same as finger picks, but, just have to develop a different style. I'm not such a great player, but have made a few sound tracks, mainly to demonstrate the tone of my lap steels I build. So, it can be done. Sometimes I get frustrated because I cannot use finger picks, but, it is what it is.

Wayne Johnson
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I am on Facebook as Innovative Guitars. Photos of all my work in photo album. I no longer make lap steels, but still make tone bars.

Keith Barron · From: British Columbia, Canada

I like to think of myself as pretty well versed in "Forums". I try to find a good one for almost every interest I have. This one fills every need I have related to steel guitar, which I am learning to play. I can't find a better place with nicer folks to help me out and satisfy my endless craving for more info. This is it for me when it comes to steel guitars. If you were to leave this forum, it would be like jumping into steel guitar and severely limiting yourself. No matter on the embarrassment, we've all been there. Carry on, live an learn. Cheerio mate!

David Mason · From: Cambridge, MD, USA

The man writes in with a serious problem, because of arthritis & injuries he can't see a way forward towards playing music. To all you glowingly-healthy kids, another phrase for arthritis & injuries is CHRONIC NERVE PAIN. Go back through it, it IS easy to see how a very new potential player might take the initial joke as a goading insult - a gross trivialization of the problem that is preventing him from PLAYING MUSIC. And every reiteration of the goddam Harmonica pile-on is another twist of the knife. So funny! So funny! Let them eat cake! Let Wayne Shriver eat cake! HAHAHAHA!

We need him more than he needs us.

Peter Lindelauf · From: Penticton, BC

"I got a very nice apology in a PM from Wayne and he is truly sorry for coming off as sort of a jerk." I hope Wayne also got a very nice apology from you for exactly the same reason, Erv.

I had to quit playing standard guitar after 40 years due to neck and hand problems. My solution was learning to play lapsteel and Weissenborn guitar. No problem with using picks and the bar takes care of my left hand problems. (Still able to play piano as well, fortunately.) After a seven year fight with Compo, I'll be receiving a large settlement for lost earnings in the near future. Part of that will be buying myself a Duesenberg Pomona. I'd rather have the full use of my left hand and no neck problems but then I wouldn't have had the pleasure and satisfaction of learning to play a new instrument starting at age 55 -- despite being partly crippled by work injuries. I empathize, Wayne, and I hope it makes you all the more determined to...play.
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...but you are the music / while the music lasts (TS Eliot)

Keith Glendinning · From: United Kingdom

Hi Wayne,
I have problems playing "normal" guitar even though I can play for a couple of hours before I "tap out" due to arthritis in my thumbs. Like you I decided to have a go at Lap Steel. I began my learning about 18 months ago and I'm very glad I did so. I started with some C6th strings on an old Strat copy and after a couple of months decided to make a "real" Lap Steel for myself. Did that and got stuck in. Finger picks never were good for me on the normal guitar and I used my finger nails. When I started Lap Steel I did the same, used my nails and it works fine, so long as they don't break! What to do then? I tried the usual picks and quickly dumped them. As I said in a previous reply, ALASKA PIKS work for me. You don't have to bend your fingers so much to use them and they're just like an extension of your own nails. For sure they take some getting used to, but persevere and you'll get there.
Please DON'T resign from the Forum, as other wiser members than myself have told told you it's the best source of free information that you could ever find.
Keith.

Mike Spieth · From: Santa Fe, New Mexico

I'm a novice, but maybe a wider string spacing, especially at the bridge, could help. I have two lap steels, and arthritis, although not as severe as yours, Wayne, and I find the wider spaced one much easier to play. I've seen a few guitars on this forum with 1/2" spacing. Maybe one of the fine builders here could modify a guitar for you.

Wayne Shriver · From: New York, USA

Thanks for the support here. I didn't say what I originally said because I am a quitter or a jerk. Having said that, I have sent better posts before, so I'd like to have that one back. Also, I played harmonica way before playing guitar. I will be playing lap steel and I will play it well. Sorry I got things off to such a discussion that doesn't really belong here. You all have shown me that you are a bunch of great guys and we share the same passion: to be great steel players.

Don Walworth · From: Gilmer, Texas, USA

..as a new lap steel player.

Old joke: What is "Perfect Pitch"? Answer: The sound an accordion makes when it is tossed on top of a Banjo in an empty dumpster.

Wife likes to tell that one - she play a $8,500.00 accordion and her backup one cost almost $3,000.

I'm working hard to play this cheese slicer - but enjoying my attempts. Love my instructions via Skype.

Looks like a wealth of good information has been supplied on just this one post!

Don

Alan Brookes · From: Brummy living in Southern California

Can't use finger picks ?
Then don't.
Plenty of steel guitarists play without them.

Bill Hatcher · From: Atlanta Ga. USA

i just found a PM from wayne. nice correspondence and i appreciate it. hope he hangs here. especially since its the best place on the net for steel guitar!!

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